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How come all Maven criticism is completely off the mark? @mml: Maven is in no way ant-based. It has an ant-plugin but that's pretty much all. @dustin: The rel

by mtrimpe 17y ago

How come all Maven criticism is completely off the mark? @mml: Maven is in no way ant-based. It has an ant-plugin but that's pretty much all. @dustin: The release thing? It's called the 'release-plugin'.

mml 17y ago
Maven is clearly ant++. The concept of XML as buld descriptor language is clearly lifted direcly from ant. It's a tragedy that the java environment is so comparatively weird that make & cousins weren't obvious choices to build java projects. I spent a majority of the last decade & change dealing with ant and maven builds on million line projects. My hatred for both is from years of bitter experience. Sorry, I hate them both with the zed-like fury of a billion suns.
- jbooth 17y ago
  My opinion of Maven is the same as Winston Churchill's opinion of democracy: "It's the worst system, aside from all the other systems." I've seen plenty of makefiles bomb out on systems that were different from the system they were written for -- it's hard to have that problem with Maven. And the idea of a versioned repo that stores multiple revisions of all of your components is awesome, provided you actually use it correctly and don't leave everything at 0.1-SNAPSHOT forever. The problem it's solving is inherently hellish, so while there could be better ways of solving it, Maven's the least crappy one I've seen so far.
dlsspy 17y ago
I'm aware of the release plugin -- I also was when I wrote it. I didn't see much of a difference between it and the SCM plugin. I replied to such criticism on my post, so I'll just paste that response here: I'm aware of the release plugin. It adds automation to the stuff I said I didn't like in "My Build System is Not My SCM" I do not want "make" tagging my releases. That's not its job and it does not have the information required to do it correctly. My tags look like this: http://pastebin.com/1vQnC78C http://pastebin.com/1vQnC78C Note the following: * List of changes * List of contributors * List of bugs fixed * GPG signature on the tag ensuring cryptographic certainty of the source The maven release plugin cannot do that. It is worse than what I have now.

by mtrimpe 17y ago

mml 17y ago

Maven is clearly ant++. The concept of XML as buld descriptor language is clearly lifted direcly from ant. It's a tragedy that the java environment is so comparatively weird that make & cousins weren't obvious choices to build java projects. I spent a majority of the last decade & change dealing with ant and maven builds on million line projects. My hatred for both is from years of bitter experience. Sorry, I hate them both with the zed-like fury of a billion suns.

jbooth 17y ago
My opinion of Maven is the same as Winston Churchill's opinion of democracy: "It's the worst system, aside from all the other systems." I've seen plenty of makefiles bomb out on systems that were different from the system they were written for -- it's hard to have that problem with Maven. And the idea of a versioned repo that stores multiple revisions of all of your components is awesome, provided you actually use it correctly and don't leave everything at 0.1-SNAPSHOT forever. The problem it's solving is inherently hellish, so while there could be better ways of solving it, Maven's the least crappy one I've seen so far.

dlsspy 17y ago

I'm aware of the release plugin -- I also was when I wrote it. I didn't see much of a difference between it and the SCM plugin. I replied to such criticism on my post, so I'll just paste that response here: I'm aware of the release plugin. It adds automation to the stuff I said I didn't like in "My Build System is Not My SCM" I do not want "make" tagging my releases. That's not its job and it does not have the information required to do it correctly. My tags look like this: http://pastebin.com/1vQnC78C http://pastebin.com/1vQnC78C Note the following: * List of changes * List of contributors * List of bugs fixed * GPG signature on the tag ensuring cryptographic certainty of the source The maven release plugin cannot do that. It is worse than what I have now.