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Thanks a lot, you really understood my problem :) I don't want to learn PHP, now I have to decide if it's going to be Python or Ruby. Can you please point me s

by german 19y ago

Thanks a lot, you really understood my problem :) I don't want to learn PHP, now I have to decide if it's going to be Python or Ruby. Can you please point me some of the information sources you used. Thanks again.

mrevelle 19y ago
If you do decide to go with Python, web.py (http://webpy.org/ http://webpy.org/) is simple and you'll be up and running fast. If you're interested in how it all works, dig into WSGI. And if you find that web.py is too low level, transition to Django after you have a feel for how web apps work.
- ardit33 19y ago
  Unfortunately webpy is poorly documented. Not good for a beginner. It is better for those people that know python well, and like to have absolute control of what's going on, and don't like the overhead of a large framework. While webpy is small, I found myself often looking at the code, which has little commenting, to understand what's going on, or how to use a certain feature, mainly b/c the documentation is so lacking. CherryPy might be a better choice.
food79 19y ago
I wouldn't spend too much time deciding between the two--they are more or less functionally equivalent, so just pick one and don't look back. Python is a little more "corporate", with a little more regimented style (e.g. significant whitespace, PEP style guide - http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/ http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/). CherryPy is super-simple to get started. Ruby is a little more "hacker", with a more idiosyncratic cast of characters such as DHH and _Why and a little more focus on coolness and tricks. Rails is the way to go, but you can get up and running with the basics with the Camping Framework in about 10 minutes.
iamelgringo 19y ago
Honestly, if you're going to make a serious study of the subject, I'd suggest an O'Reilly Safari subscription. For $15 a month, you get access to 10 books at a time. For $40 a month, you get access to their entire library. I'm not a shill for the service, I just really like the service. It's well worth the cash. Online tutorials are good for a quick, down and dirty overview of a topic. But, if you're going to learn something a bit more in depth, I'd think that you're better off looking at a book. It's pricey, but it's worth it for me. I figure I'd spend $40 a month on tech books anyway. I'd might as well pay them and get the whole library as well as the Lynda.com video all at the same time. Also, if you're really serious about it, I might consider finding a web database development class or certificate program somewhere. It might be slower going than you want, but you'll have a more complete understanding of the subjects once you were done.
- sgoraya 19y ago
  Agreed - I would also recommend taking a class or two if you have the time. Decent community colleges will have many courses for web development ranging from beginner to intermediate. Studying and learning in a classroom environment has many benefits - Who knows, you might meet a few new friends and like minded folks as well! Good Luck! (PS: In the Bay area, foothill college is great, IMHO, for continued education)
  - cdr 19y ago
    Also, if you're taking classes, you may have free access to Safari and other ebook collections through the school's library.
jraines 19y ago
You can try ruby with one of the great online interactive tutorials of all time here: http://tryruby.hobix.com/ http://tryruby.hobix.com/ And from there you can start playing with Rails, which is a joy to use. I recommend starting with "Agile Web Development with Rails". I've only read excerpts from "The Rails Way" but it seems good, too. Bottom line for me -- programming Ruby and building Rails apps is fun.
aaroniba 19y ago
Out of curiosity, why don't you want to learn PHP?
- german 19y ago
  Because I've seen PHP code and it looks too messy for me. Just my opinion.
  - kajecounterhack 19y ago
    Learn it with a framework, like CakePHP. Turns it into MVC programming like Rails or anything else.
    - jamesbritt 19y ago
      > Turns it into MVC programming like Rails or anything else. Why not then just use Django or Turbo Gears or Ramaze or Nitro then? In the end, you have to live with the underlying language.

by german 19y ago

mrevelle 19y ago

If you do decide to go with Python, web.py (http://webpy.org/ http://webpy.org/) is simple and you'll be up and running fast. If you're interested in how it all works, dig into WSGI. And if you find that web.py is too low level, transition to Django after you have a feel for how web apps work.

ardit33 19y ago
Unfortunately webpy is poorly documented. Not good for a beginner. It is better for those people that know python well, and like to have absolute control of what's going on, and don't like the overhead of a large framework. While webpy is small, I found myself often looking at the code, which has little commenting, to understand what's going on, or how to use a certain feature, mainly b/c the documentation is so lacking. CherryPy might be a better choice.

food79 19y ago

I wouldn't spend too much time deciding between the two--they are more or less functionally equivalent, so just pick one and don't look back. Python is a little more "corporate", with a little more regimented style (e.g. significant whitespace, PEP style guide - http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/ http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/). CherryPy is super-simple to get started. Ruby is a little more "hacker", with a more idiosyncratic cast of characters such as DHH and _Why and a little more focus on coolness and tricks. Rails is the way to go, but you can get up and running with the basics with the Camping Framework in about 10 minutes.

iamelgringo 19y ago

Honestly, if you're going to make a serious study of the subject, I'd suggest an O'Reilly Safari subscription. For $15 a month, you get access to 10 books at a time. For $40 a month, you get access to their entire library. I'm not a shill for the service, I just really like the service. It's well worth the cash. Online tutorials are good for a quick, down and dirty overview of a topic. But, if you're going to learn something a bit more in depth, I'd think that you're better off looking at a book. It's pricey, but it's worth it for me. I figure I'd spend $40 a month on tech books anyway. I'd might as well pay them and get the whole library as well as the Lynda.com video all at the same time. Also, if you're really serious about it, I might consider finding a web database development class or certificate program somewhere. It might be slower going than you want, but you'll have a more complete understanding of the subjects once you were done.

sgoraya 19y ago
Agreed - I would also recommend taking a class or two if you have the time. Decent community colleges will have many courses for web development ranging from beginner to intermediate. Studying and learning in a classroom environment has many benefits - Who knows, you might meet a few new friends and like minded folks as well! Good Luck! (PS: In the Bay area, foothill college is great, IMHO, for continued education)
- cdr 19y ago
  Also, if you're taking classes, you may have free access to Safari and other ebook collections through the school's library.

jraines 19y ago

You can try ruby with one of the great online interactive tutorials of all time here: http://tryruby.hobix.com/ http://tryruby.hobix.com/ And from there you can start playing with Rails, which is a joy to use. I recommend starting with "Agile Web Development with Rails". I've only read excerpts from "The Rails Way" but it seems good, too. Bottom line for me -- programming Ruby and building Rails apps is fun.

aaroniba 19y ago

Out of curiosity, why don't you want to learn PHP?

german 19y ago
Because I've seen PHP code and it looks too messy for me. Just my opinion.
- kajecounterhack 19y ago
  Learn it with a framework, like CakePHP. Turns it into MVC programming like Rails or anything else.
  - jamesbritt 19y ago
    > Turns it into MVC programming like Rails or anything else. Why not then just use Django or Turbo Gears or Ramaze or Nitro then? In the end, you have to live with the underlying language.