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Honestly I wish they wouldn't try to compete on price. Maybe I'm alone with this, but I'd rather not feel obligated to tip a driver because the ride is so cheap

Honestly I wish they wouldn't try to compete on price. Maybe I'm alone with this, but I'd rather not feel obligated to tip a driver because the ride is so cheap. Pay them a living wage, let me pay the exact fee, and let me not have to carry goddamn cash like I used to in the era of Taxis. e: Addressing common replies: "This is for people commuting already" -- okay, point taken; my point about Uber/Lyft still stands. "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. Uber used to bar drivers form asking, but they recently lost a lawsuit over that rule and so now Uber drivers will occasionally ask for tips (which will cause it to slowly become the norm). When tipping becomes the norm, the low-base-wage of the driver becomes less of an 'issue', and then tipping becomes even more of a necessity as that is where the drivers will make their actual margins.

inlined 10y ago
FTA: the price is intended to be low enough that one wouldn't try to use this to be a taxi driver. It reminds me of the days when someone offered to chip in for gas in exchange for carpooling. Disclaimer: I'm a Google employee but have never heard anything about this before.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  EDIT: Oh, nevermind.
  - saalweachter 10y ago
    Keeping up with everything Google is doing is itself a full time job. I barely have time to keep up with all of the gazillion announcements in my own tiny corner of the world that affect my day job, so I'm usually as surprised as anyone when something "big" happens in a different part of the company.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
stingrae 10y ago
The point of the service is not for people who drive for a living. It is for people already headed in the same direction to carpool. So the benefit of getting paid is just a bonus as long as it isn't far out of the driver's way.
speg 10y ago
I took an Uber home from the train station last week and it was less than $15. I'm not sure how much a taxi would've been, probably at least $25. I don't feel good about it. How can someone provide good service if they're taking home so little? I fear that soon Uber will be overrun with poor service because all the quality drivers have been driven out by low costs.
- Eric_WVGG 10y ago
  Talk to your drivers about it. So far they've all told me that they get more passengers thanks to the app, and the pay from Uber's base rate outweighs unpredictable tips. [edit] NYC, and the drivers are pretty candid about still picking up rides from black car dispatchers and competitors. I have no reason to question their honesty.
  - eropple 10y ago
    I think it's worth considering whether those drivers are incentivized to tell you the truth. I can't say either way, but I wouldn't put it past Uber to instill reasons for defensive praise of the service.
    - icantdrive55 10y ago
      I've had some lousy jobs, and it seems like the worse the job is, the less the employees complain. It's a weird form of denial, or something else? Safeway bucks that observation. Safeway managed to irritate every employee, including my deceased father. He hated that company with a passion. In his late twenties, he became an electrician, and loved the work, and union pay.
  - secure 10y ago
    All drivers I’ve talked to (mostly in the London area) told me they are very unhappy with their pay, but because Uber is so cheap, they can’t drive for their old cab companies anymore (all business moved to Uber).
    - 10y ago
rm_-rf_slash 10y ago
It's only a matter of time until the cars are completely driverless. Will you feel better knowing that there isn't anybody behind the wheel being taken advantage of, but also no longer has this option to make money for themselves? I'm not being sarcastic. I honestly don't know how I feel about it either.
- xapata 10y ago
  I'll take Johnny Cab without guilt. History is littered with jobs that don't exist anymore. Either we'll make more kinds of jobs, or we'll find a way to deal with the fact that we don't need as many workers.
imgabe 10y ago
There should never be an obligation to tip. The whole point of tipping is that it's not obligatory. I get that we've messed that up for a lot of professions, like restaurant servers, but Uber et al have a chance to reset the social norms at least around taxi-esque services and they should take it.
- ethanbond 10y ago
  If it's not obligatory to tip then it should be obligatory to pay people a living wage, in any context.
  - riboflava 10y ago
    Living wage destroys the ability for people to make a little extra on the side with part-time gigs.
    - selestify 10y ago
      Why would that be?
    - alkonaut 10y ago
      How is that? A part time job would pay a part of a living wage.
    - gingerrr 10y ago
      You realize that "living wage" is only a price floor for labor, not a price ceiling, right? It is a guarantee that people are paid at a minimum the amount necessary to support themselves, with various definitions excluding or including that person's family situation from consideration. Instituting a living wage would in no way prevent you from working extra and being paid extra for that work. I'm inclined to believe you haven't actually researched what a living wage is or would entail to enact, because the inaccuracy of the claim you're making is egregious.
      - greenshackle 10y ago
honkhonkpants 10y ago
Every driver I've asked has said they make more with Uber than they did as a taxi driver. I don't know if it's a decent wage, but it's more than they were getting.
Myrmornis 10y ago
Anything as long as it is not exploitative (I personally have no concerns over this regarding Uber but I certainly include it as a criterion) and does not involve tipping. Tipping is described as an opportunity to "reward excellent service" but in reality it satisfies the parts of the brain that respond to being given the opportunity to temporarily act as a financial master over other human beings.
ancap 10y ago
"Living wage"? Are you suggesting that uber and other drivers are all dead? \s (I know "living wage" is the hip buzzword, but it is a poor phrase, is hyperbolic, and creates a false picture that when these workers finish their shift they are going to go find some secluded gutter to die in from malnutrition)
- emodendroket 10y ago
  No it doesn't.
  - xapata 10y ago
    Frankly, I think that was the intention of the person who coined the term "living wage". But that's perfectly fine. It's like saying "pro-life" instead of saying "anti-choice". Use whatever phrase helps you get your message across. I'm not in the habit of saying "living wage," but if I wanted to say, "a person can't live on 5 dollars an hour" in a pithy manner, that's what I'd say. A literal-minded person might get annoyed at that, but most people understand that it's an ethical statement, not a literal one.
    - emodendroket 10y ago
      Many workers not making a living wage receive some form of government assistance, so saying that they aren't all dying in a gutter seems beside the point.
      - jschwartzi 10y ago
        And the point of forcing employers to pay a living wage is so that we don't have to subsidize their businesses via government assistance to their workers.
        emodendroket 10y ago
        Well, I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say it's the entire point, but it is definitely a compelling reason.
dragonwriter 10y ago
> Honestly I wish they wouldn't try to compete on price. Waze Carpool is more targeted at actual ridesharing (and designed specifically to support to/from work carpooling), not a taxi service using "ridesharing" as a misleading name. Its not really trying to compete with price as it is offering a slightly different service (its kind of like UberPOOL, except its really focusing on -- though not strictly limited to -- the case where the driver is also one of the passengers with a need to go to the destination, or from the source, or, ideally, approximately both.)
- eva1984 10y ago
  Uber has Uber Pool for the exact same purpose.
  - gleenn 10y ago
    Not exactly. Uberpool drivers still don't want to actually go to the destination the customer does. Google's offer appears to be trying to coordinate cars of people who are all trying to get somewhere.
    - cmdrfred 10y ago
      That might circumvent some of the legal issues Uber has had, a lot of cities have ride-share programs.
      - adevine 10y ago
        They are circumventing the legal issues by limiting to 54 cents per mile, which is the IRS standard mileage rate: https://www.irs.gov/uac/newsroom/2016-standard-mileage-rates-for-business-medical-and-moving-announced https://www.irs.gov/uac/newsroom/2016-standard-mileage-rates.... That is, at this rate it's just considered a reimbursement for gas/wear and tear on the vehicle, not actual income for services provided.
  - DasIch 10y ago
    No, it isn't because the driver still makes a profit with Uber Pool and they didn't intend to travel where they're going. In Germany for example ride sharing under the legal definition requires that the driver doesn't make any profit and really just takes people along. If that's the case, you don't require additional/different insurance etc.
SamChoi 10y ago
If you've had a nice ride than it makes sense to tip but no one should feel pressured out of obligation.
- euyyn 10y ago
  Just rate the guy extra well. Tip him with publicity so he gets more business.
- criddell 10y ago
  For the past six or eight months, I've tipped every Uber driver. Not out of a sense of obligation though, but because he or she took great care of me.
exacube 10y ago
I find it odd to tip for professions where they earn decently; restaurant waiters don't earn much (they earn 'restaurant minimums' or even under the table) and rely on tips. Uber and Lyft drivers earn decently ($20/hr+ in the bay area, $30/hr+ in NYC), and I wouldn't consider tipping them if I was earning similarly/less than they are. OTOH, if you're a high earner and paying a tip doesn't make a difference to you financially (but does to someone else), then you should do it!
- revelation 10y ago
  $20/hr+ in the bay area, $30/hr+ in NYC Neither of which makes for a "decent" living, particularly if you correct that for wear & tear.
intopieces 10y ago
The driver here is not supposed to be getting a livable wage, because the driver should be headed to their full time job that will provide them with a livable wage... the fee here (Google isn't even taking a cut) would be to create a minor incentive and make up for gas/wear-and-tear.
ykler 10y ago
They want to stay below the IRS caps on cost reimbursement for drivers (https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/individuals/standard-mileage-rates-glance https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/individuals/standard-...). If drivers make more than that, they would have to carry special insurance and maybe be vetted.
- jacalata 10y ago
  That page doesn't seem to mention caps and I've never heard of such a thing. Do you have any more information on that?
  - ykler 10y ago
    Ridesharing law is a bit of a gray area, but I was looking into it a couple years ago, and it seemed to be a dominant interpretation that the IRS limit was determining for whether something could be considered true ridesharing and not subject to regulations that companies like Uber have to deal with. There is a company called Carma that was operating under that cap at the time (but I just checked their site, and they seem to have changed their model to a subscription thing). Here is one link I found in five minutes of googling that mentions using the IRS cap: http://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/PublishedDocs/Efile/G000/M042/K158/42158728.PDF http://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/PublishedDocs/Efile/G000/M042/K158/4... There are better sources, but I don't have them handy.
    - ykler 10y ago
      OK, here is a better link suggesting that the 54 cent/mile rate mentioned by the WSJ article isn't just about undercutting Uber but also about avoiding legal problems. http://kxan.com/2014/02/25/ride-sharing-app-gets-green-light-from-city-of-austin/ http://kxan.com/2014/02/25/ride-sharing-app-gets-green-light... From the article: "Heyride, a ride-sharing program, was forced to shut down operations in the city because drivers did not have permits, the Austin Transportation Department said. The city says when drivers can set their own rates and earn a profit, that’s when they’re treated like taxi cabs. “It’s not friends taking friends, it’s the money being exchanged, the compensation,” said Steve Grassfield, with The Austin Transportation Department. With Carma Carpool, riders pay 20 cents per mile and drivers earn 17 cents per mile to pay for gas and car maintenance. Federal regulations say drivers who earn anything less than 56 cents per mile are not considered vehicles-for-hire."
kylec 10y ago
"Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. Uber used to bar drivers form asking, but they recently lost a lawsuit over that rule and so now Uber drivers will occasionally ask for tips (which will cause it to slowly become the norm). I'm pretty sure I was recently given a low rating by a driver on Uber because I didn't tip. From my perspective the ride went perfectly fine, and I wasn't even asked for a tip, but I checked my rating later and it went down from the perfect 5.0 I used to have. If this becomes the norm, tipping will become mandatory because all the drivers will know who tips and who doesn't and will adjust service (or lack of service) accordingly.
- nommm-nommm 10y ago
  Drivers rate passengers? Where can I see my rating?
  - kylec 10y ago
    https://help.uber.com/h/e9302f73-8625-427f-abf7-dbe7ab25af7d https://help.uber.com/h/e9302f73-8625-427f-abf7-dbe7ab25af7d
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
serge2k 10y ago
> yes, it kind of is. No it's not, and you're ruining things by tipping. I hate tipping.
1propionyl 10y ago
Tipping is in my mind toxic to long term growth of ride sharing. It makes the user have to think, it's just bad UX.
freyr 10y ago
> "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. No, it really isn't. I've never been asked by an Uber driver for a tip, nor would I give a tip if asked. In fact, I'd probably dock a point from their rating. Put the onus back on the company to pay an honest wage, and let everybody pay the same price for a ride (rather than tippers subsidizing rides for non-tippers).
dclowd9901 10y ago
If I have to tip uber drivers, guess i have no use for it. The whole point is to be frictionless.
mtgx 10y ago
> "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. Do you think that if they received, let's say twice the salary Google intends to give them, they wouldn't "expect" a tip anymore? It's up to you whether you want to tip or not. If he "expects" it and makes it known, give him a lower rating.
LordHumungous 10y ago
>Uber drivers will occasionally ask for tips I've never had anyone ask me for a tip. I think that ship has sailed as far as Uber goes. It's now the expectation that you don't tip uber drivers. Hard to see how that changes.
- euyyn 10y ago
  Even if someone did ask me, I'd tell them that one of the reasons I use Uber is to not have to carry any cash.
gjolund 10y ago
You could always just not tip.
pikachu_is_cool 10y ago
I, on the other hand, would prefer them to compete on price. I like saving money.
morgante 10y ago
> "Tipping isn't obligatory" In what way is it obligatory? The vast majority of Uber riders don't tip, and have no intention of doing so.
- hackernews2000 10y ago
  They must have meant "culturally obligatory". Americans (at least New Yorkers) have a tradition of giving generous tips to all workers they perceive as not making a living wage. In other countries, tipping isn't as common and can be even be seen as rude (in Japan, for example).
  - morgante 10y ago
    I'm American and live in New York. You don't tip Uber drivers. I'm sure some small percentage of people do, but it's definitely not the expectation. (Taxi drivers, on the other hand, do expect tips.)
dacox 10y ago
Not feeling obligated to tip was almost the entire reason I prefer Uber over traditional cab companies in the first place.
xapata 10y ago
> "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is The driver can put up a sign asking for a tip, but I don't feel obliged to give one. I don't tip the cook in a restaurant. I don't tip the receptionist at a hotel. I don't tip the farmhands who picked the vegetables I eat at the supermarket. I don't tip the truck driver who unloaded all the goods I buy. I wish all of these people earned a higher wage and I'd be happy to pay more at the point of sale, but I wish the practice of tipping disappeared.
- colejohnson66 10y ago
  What's appalling to me is that tipping (regardless of QoS) is even still a thing. Tipping was made big during the Great Depression. After the economy rose back up, tipped wages should've been rose back up to match minimum. Effectively abolishing the ridiculous idea of tipping even if your service sucks. Thankfully, a few states have realized how ridiculous the current system is and made it mandatory tipped wages (before tips) are the same as non tipped wages (California being one of them).
JDiculous 10y ago
You're against paying less as a result of increased business competition? Are you a driver or an shareholder of Uber/Lyft? I routinely take Uber and Lyft and have never been asked for a tip. I never plan to tip either because it's not part of the deal. It's the company's job to provide them a livable compensation, not mine. Not tipping is already culturally entrenched in these services, so them suddenly trying to make it a cultural norm isn't going to work because most of us are against tipping culture.
- ThomPete 10y ago
  Uber discourage drivers from asking for tips, the Lyft app ask you to give one.
pmorici 10y ago
Use Lyft, they let you tip in app then you don't have to carry cash.
mark_l_watson 10y ago
I agree with you. I have used Uber when visiting San Francisco and San Diego and all 9 rides have been great, but the price seems low. We now know that they lost 1.2 billion dollars over a six month period. BTW, I have always used Uber in ride sharing mode, never exclusive. I don't mind cash tipping since I always travel with lots of small bills. The secret of good hotel experiences is handing out of modest tips to everyone who helps you, and including Uber drivers seems fair enough. EDIT: re: hotel tipping: I tend to stay at the same hotels when I travel. Still, tipping maids and other helpful people should be done regardless of expectations of good service during future stays.
abrbhat 10y ago
In India, the concept has taken off because of Uber and Ola subsidizing the fares by paying the difference from VC money. The moment they stop subsidizing and start raising prices to make them par with what drivers get paid, the consumers will shift back to auto-rickshaws. If they start dropping prices, the drivers will shift back to inter-city routes.
piyush_soni 10y ago
Tipping is the worst form of 'wage', and it's sad that restaurants in United States have made it a norm already.
x2398dh1 10y ago
This is going to be buried, because I'm way late to the party here...but interestingly, Uber automatically sets your tip level at 20% for Uber TAXI in your settings, which you can change down to 0% and up to 30%.
rayvd 10y ago
Don't feel obligated or bad about it. If the job isn't meeting the driver's financial needs, he'll start doing something else. The market can sort this out for you.

inlined 10y ago

FTA: the price is intended to be low enough that one wouldn't try to use this to be a taxi driver. It reminds me of the days when someone offered to chip in for gas in exchange for carpooling. Disclaimer: I'm a Google employee but have never heard anything about this before.

dragonwriter 10y ago
EDIT: Oh, nevermind.
- saalweachter 10y ago
  Keeping up with everything Google is doing is itself a full time job. I barely have time to keep up with all of the gazillion announcements in my own tiny corner of the world that affect my day job, so I'm usually as surprised as anyone when something "big" happens in a different part of the company.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]

stingrae 10y ago

The point of the service is not for people who drive for a living. It is for people already headed in the same direction to carpool. So the benefit of getting paid is just a bonus as long as it isn't far out of the driver's way.

speg 10y ago

I took an Uber home from the train station last week and it was less than $15. I'm not sure how much a taxi would've been, probably at least $25. I don't feel good about it. How can someone provide good service if they're taking home so little? I fear that soon Uber will be overrun with poor service because all the quality drivers have been driven out by low costs.

Eric_WVGG 10y ago
Talk to your drivers about it. So far they've all told me that they get more passengers thanks to the app, and the pay from Uber's base rate outweighs unpredictable tips. [edit] NYC, and the drivers are pretty candid about still picking up rides from black car dispatchers and competitors. I have no reason to question their honesty.
- eropple 10y ago
  I think it's worth considering whether those drivers are incentivized to tell you the truth. I can't say either way, but I wouldn't put it past Uber to instill reasons for defensive praise of the service.
  - icantdrive55 10y ago
    I've had some lousy jobs, and it seems like the worse the job is, the less the employees complain. It's a weird form of denial, or something else? Safeway bucks that observation. Safeway managed to irritate every employee, including my deceased father. He hated that company with a passion. In his late twenties, he became an electrician, and loved the work, and union pay.
- secure 10y ago
  All drivers I’ve talked to (mostly in the London area) told me they are very unhappy with their pay, but because Uber is so cheap, they can’t drive for their old cab companies anymore (all business moved to Uber).
  - 10y ago

rm_-rf_slash 10y ago

It's only a matter of time until the cars are completely driverless. Will you feel better knowing that there isn't anybody behind the wheel being taken advantage of, but also no longer has this option to make money for themselves? I'm not being sarcastic. I honestly don't know how I feel about it either.

xapata 10y ago
I'll take Johnny Cab without guilt. History is littered with jobs that don't exist anymore. Either we'll make more kinds of jobs, or we'll find a way to deal with the fact that we don't need as many workers.

imgabe 10y ago

There should never be an obligation to tip. The whole point of tipping is that it's not obligatory. I get that we've messed that up for a lot of professions, like restaurant servers, but Uber et al have a chance to reset the social norms at least around taxi-esque services and they should take it.

ethanbond 10y ago
If it's not obligatory to tip then it should be obligatory to pay people a living wage, in any context.
- riboflava 10y ago
  Living wage destroys the ability for people to make a little extra on the side with part-time gigs.
  - selestify 10y ago
    Why would that be?
  - alkonaut 10y ago
    How is that? A part time job would pay a part of a living wage.
  - gingerrr 10y ago
    You realize that "living wage" is only a price floor for labor, not a price ceiling, right? It is a guarantee that people are paid at a minimum the amount necessary to support themselves, with various definitions excluding or including that person's family situation from consideration. Instituting a living wage would in no way prevent you from working extra and being paid extra for that work. I'm inclined to believe you haven't actually researched what a living wage is or would entail to enact, because the inaccuracy of the claim you're making is egregious.
    - greenshackle 10y ago

honkhonkpants 10y ago

Every driver I've asked has said they make more with Uber than they did as a taxi driver. I don't know if it's a decent wage, but it's more than they were getting.

Myrmornis 10y ago

Anything as long as it is not exploitative (I personally have no concerns over this regarding Uber but I certainly include it as a criterion) and does not involve tipping. Tipping is described as an opportunity to "reward excellent service" but in reality it satisfies the parts of the brain that respond to being given the opportunity to temporarily act as a financial master over other human beings.

ancap 10y ago

"Living wage"? Are you suggesting that uber and other drivers are all dead? \s (I know "living wage" is the hip buzzword, but it is a poor phrase, is hyperbolic, and creates a false picture that when these workers finish their shift they are going to go find some secluded gutter to die in from malnutrition)

emodendroket 10y ago
No it doesn't.
- xapata 10y ago
  Frankly, I think that was the intention of the person who coined the term "living wage". But that's perfectly fine. It's like saying "pro-life" instead of saying "anti-choice". Use whatever phrase helps you get your message across. I'm not in the habit of saying "living wage," but if I wanted to say, "a person can't live on 5 dollars an hour" in a pithy manner, that's what I'd say. A literal-minded person might get annoyed at that, but most people understand that it's an ethical statement, not a literal one.
  - emodendroket 10y ago
    Many workers not making a living wage receive some form of government assistance, so saying that they aren't all dying in a gutter seems beside the point.
    - jschwartzi 10y ago
      And the point of forcing employers to pay a living wage is so that we don't have to subsidize their businesses via government assistance to their workers.
      - emodendroket 10y ago
        Well, I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say it's the entire point, but it is definitely a compelling reason.

dragonwriter 10y ago

> Honestly I wish they wouldn't try to compete on price. Waze Carpool is more targeted at actual ridesharing (and designed specifically to support to/from work carpooling), not a taxi service using "ridesharing" as a misleading name. Its not really trying to compete with price as it is offering a slightly different service (its kind of like UberPOOL, except its really focusing on -- though not strictly limited to -- the case where the driver is also one of the passengers with a need to go to the destination, or from the source, or, ideally, approximately both.)

eva1984 10y ago
Uber has Uber Pool for the exact same purpose.
- gleenn 10y ago
  Not exactly. Uberpool drivers still don't want to actually go to the destination the customer does. Google's offer appears to be trying to coordinate cars of people who are all trying to get somewhere.
  - cmdrfred 10y ago
    That might circumvent some of the legal issues Uber has had, a lot of cities have ride-share programs.
    - adevine 10y ago
      They are circumventing the legal issues by limiting to 54 cents per mile, which is the IRS standard mileage rate: https://www.irs.gov/uac/newsroom/2016-standard-mileage-rates-for-business-medical-and-moving-announced https://www.irs.gov/uac/newsroom/2016-standard-mileage-rates.... That is, at this rate it's just considered a reimbursement for gas/wear and tear on the vehicle, not actual income for services provided.
- DasIch 10y ago
  No, it isn't because the driver still makes a profit with Uber Pool and they didn't intend to travel where they're going. In Germany for example ride sharing under the legal definition requires that the driver doesn't make any profit and really just takes people along. If that's the case, you don't require additional/different insurance etc.

SamChoi 10y ago

If you've had a nice ride than it makes sense to tip but no one should feel pressured out of obligation.

euyyn 10y ago
Just rate the guy extra well. Tip him with publicity so he gets more business.
criddell 10y ago
For the past six or eight months, I've tipped every Uber driver. Not out of a sense of obligation though, but because he or she took great care of me.

exacube 10y ago

I find it odd to tip for professions where they earn decently; restaurant waiters don't earn much (they earn 'restaurant minimums' or even under the table) and rely on tips. Uber and Lyft drivers earn decently ($20/hr+ in the bay area, $30/hr+ in NYC), and I wouldn't consider tipping them if I was earning similarly/less than they are. OTOH, if you're a high earner and paying a tip doesn't make a difference to you financially (but does to someone else), then you should do it!

revelation 10y ago
$20/hr+ in the bay area, $30/hr+ in NYC Neither of which makes for a "decent" living, particularly if you correct that for wear & tear.

intopieces 10y ago

The driver here is not supposed to be getting a livable wage, because the driver should be headed to their full time job that will provide them with a livable wage... the fee here (Google isn't even taking a cut) would be to create a minor incentive and make up for gas/wear-and-tear.

ykler 10y ago

They want to stay below the IRS caps on cost reimbursement for drivers (https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/individuals/standard-mileage-rates-glance https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/individuals/standard-...). If drivers make more than that, they would have to carry special insurance and maybe be vetted.

jacalata 10y ago
That page doesn't seem to mention caps and I've never heard of such a thing. Do you have any more information on that?
- ykler 10y ago
  Ridesharing law is a bit of a gray area, but I was looking into it a couple years ago, and it seemed to be a dominant interpretation that the IRS limit was determining for whether something could be considered true ridesharing and not subject to regulations that companies like Uber have to deal with. There is a company called Carma that was operating under that cap at the time (but I just checked their site, and they seem to have changed their model to a subscription thing). Here is one link I found in five minutes of googling that mentions using the IRS cap: http://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/PublishedDocs/Efile/G000/M042/K158/42158728.PDF http://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/PublishedDocs/Efile/G000/M042/K158/4... There are better sources, but I don't have them handy.
  - ykler 10y ago
    OK, here is a better link suggesting that the 54 cent/mile rate mentioned by the WSJ article isn't just about undercutting Uber but also about avoiding legal problems. http://kxan.com/2014/02/25/ride-sharing-app-gets-green-light-from-city-of-austin/ http://kxan.com/2014/02/25/ride-sharing-app-gets-green-light... From the article: "Heyride, a ride-sharing program, was forced to shut down operations in the city because drivers did not have permits, the Austin Transportation Department said. The city says when drivers can set their own rates and earn a profit, that’s when they’re treated like taxi cabs. “It’s not friends taking friends, it’s the money being exchanged, the compensation,” said Steve Grassfield, with The Austin Transportation Department. With Carma Carpool, riders pay 20 cents per mile and drivers earn 17 cents per mile to pay for gas and car maintenance. Federal regulations say drivers who earn anything less than 56 cents per mile are not considered vehicles-for-hire."

kylec 10y ago

"Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. Uber used to bar drivers form asking, but they recently lost a lawsuit over that rule and so now Uber drivers will occasionally ask for tips (which will cause it to slowly become the norm). I'm pretty sure I was recently given a low rating by a driver on Uber because I didn't tip. From my perspective the ride went perfectly fine, and I wasn't even asked for a tip, but I checked my rating later and it went down from the perfect 5.0 I used to have. If this becomes the norm, tipping will become mandatory because all the drivers will know who tips and who doesn't and will adjust service (or lack of service) accordingly.

nommm-nommm 10y ago
Drivers rate passengers? Where can I see my rating?
- kylec 10y ago
  https://help.uber.com/h/e9302f73-8625-427f-abf7-dbe7ab25af7d https://help.uber.com/h/e9302f73-8625-427f-abf7-dbe7ab25af7d
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

serge2k 10y ago

> yes, it kind of is. No it's not, and you're ruining things by tipping. I hate tipping.

1propionyl 10y ago

Tipping is in my mind toxic to long term growth of ride sharing. It makes the user have to think, it's just bad UX.

freyr 10y ago

> "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. No, it really isn't. I've never been asked by an Uber driver for a tip, nor would I give a tip if asked. In fact, I'd probably dock a point from their rating. Put the onus back on the company to pay an honest wage, and let everybody pay the same price for a ride (rather than tippers subsidizing rides for non-tippers).

dclowd9901 10y ago

If I have to tip uber drivers, guess i have no use for it. The whole point is to be frictionless.

mtgx 10y ago

> "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is. Do you think that if they received, let's say twice the salary Google intends to give them, they wouldn't "expect" a tip anymore? It's up to you whether you want to tip or not. If he "expects" it and makes it known, give him a lower rating.

LordHumungous 10y ago

>Uber drivers will occasionally ask for tips I've never had anyone ask me for a tip. I think that ship has sailed as far as Uber goes. It's now the expectation that you don't tip uber drivers. Hard to see how that changes.

euyyn 10y ago
Even if someone did ask me, I'd tell them that one of the reasons I use Uber is to not have to carry any cash.

gjolund 10y ago

You could always just not tip.

pikachu_is_cool 10y ago

I, on the other hand, would prefer them to compete on price. I like saving money.

morgante 10y ago

> "Tipping isn't obligatory" In what way is it obligatory? The vast majority of Uber riders don't tip, and have no intention of doing so.

hackernews2000 10y ago
They must have meant "culturally obligatory". Americans (at least New Yorkers) have a tradition of giving generous tips to all workers they perceive as not making a living wage. In other countries, tipping isn't as common and can be even be seen as rude (in Japan, for example).
- morgante 10y ago
  I'm American and live in New York. You don't tip Uber drivers. I'm sure some small percentage of people do, but it's definitely not the expectation. (Taxi drivers, on the other hand, do expect tips.)

dacox 10y ago

Not feeling obligated to tip was almost the entire reason I prefer Uber over traditional cab companies in the first place.

xapata 10y ago

> "Tipping isn't obligatory" -- yes, it kind of is The driver can put up a sign asking for a tip, but I don't feel obliged to give one. I don't tip the cook in a restaurant. I don't tip the receptionist at a hotel. I don't tip the farmhands who picked the vegetables I eat at the supermarket. I don't tip the truck driver who unloaded all the goods I buy. I wish all of these people earned a higher wage and I'd be happy to pay more at the point of sale, but I wish the practice of tipping disappeared.

colejohnson66 10y ago
What's appalling to me is that tipping (regardless of QoS) is even still a thing. Tipping was made big during the Great Depression. After the economy rose back up, tipped wages should've been rose back up to match minimum. Effectively abolishing the ridiculous idea of tipping even if your service sucks. Thankfully, a few states have realized how ridiculous the current system is and made it mandatory tipped wages (before tips) are the same as non tipped wages (California being one of them).

JDiculous 10y ago

You're against paying less as a result of increased business competition? Are you a driver or an shareholder of Uber/Lyft? I routinely take Uber and Lyft and have never been asked for a tip. I never plan to tip either because it's not part of the deal. It's the company's job to provide them a livable compensation, not mine. Not tipping is already culturally entrenched in these services, so them suddenly trying to make it a cultural norm isn't going to work because most of us are against tipping culture.

ThomPete 10y ago
Uber discourage drivers from asking for tips, the Lyft app ask you to give one.

pmorici 10y ago

Use Lyft, they let you tip in app then you don't have to carry cash.

mark_l_watson 10y ago

I agree with you. I have used Uber when visiting San Francisco and San Diego and all 9 rides have been great, but the price seems low. We now know that they lost 1.2 billion dollars over a six month period. BTW, I have always used Uber in ride sharing mode, never exclusive. I don't mind cash tipping since I always travel with lots of small bills. The secret of good hotel experiences is handing out of modest tips to everyone who helps you, and including Uber drivers seems fair enough. EDIT: re: hotel tipping: I tend to stay at the same hotels when I travel. Still, tipping maids and other helpful people should be done regardless of expectations of good service during future stays.

abrbhat 10y ago

In India, the concept has taken off because of Uber and Ola subsidizing the fares by paying the difference from VC money. The moment they stop subsidizing and start raising prices to make them par with what drivers get paid, the consumers will shift back to auto-rickshaws. If they start dropping prices, the drivers will shift back to inter-city routes.

piyush_soni 10y ago

Tipping is the worst form of 'wage', and it's sad that restaurants in United States have made it a norm already.

x2398dh1 10y ago

This is going to be buried, because I'm way late to the party here...but interestingly, Uber automatically sets your tip level at 20% for Uber TAXI in your settings, which you can change down to 0% and up to 30%.

rayvd 10y ago

Don't feel obligated or bad about it. If the job isn't meeting the driver's financial needs, he'll start doing something else. The market can sort this out for you.