5 ms·

The notion that a 130h work week is admirable, desirable, sustainable or useful is ridiculous and should be criticised every time it's raised. Unless you're wo

by cup 10y ago

The notion that a 130h work week is admirable, desirable, sustainable or useful is ridiculous and should be criticised every time it's raised. Unless you're working for yourself or working in a job where your contract compensates you by the hour then investing such huge swathes of time I think is destructive. There is a reason workers united, fought and were martyred for the 8 hour work week and the creeping clawback by industry is a problem. That aside, very interesting to see such a consistent time keeping record.

jjeaff 10y ago
An 8 hour work week is definitely something I can get behind.
- joshmanders 10y ago
  Then you'll love my ebook "1 step to working 8 hours a week and get paid $62,262/hr by Google. Number 1 is a doozy!"
  - tomascot 10y ago
    Then you'll love my ebook "1 step to working 8 hours a week and get paid $62,263/hr writing ebooks!"
wwalser 10y ago
While I agree with your statement for the most part, I also understand that there is some context to it. That specific context is Marissa Mayer and other early Google employees. I find it hard to convince myself that those people and especially Mayer, were not or are not compensated in some way that takes those huge swathes of time into consideration. She was paid $36MM in 2015 and raised the market cap of Yahoo! by 151% in four years. Some of that compensation is based on success at Google, some of it may be based on her success at Yahoo!, but some of it is absolutely based on her brand. Her brand, in my own mind, is highly associated with her dedication to working long hours. I work long hours but I'm conscious of a few things: I don't celebrate it. I don't plan to proselytize it like Mayer does. Part of those long hours are dedicated to operationalizing time-sinks so that I don't have to do it forever. I don't expect others around me, especially non-founders, to do the same and like you I believe that for them to do so would likely be a net-negative.
- arntatis 10y ago
  Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? Could it have been done if she worked 50% less hours? A difficult question to answer with evidence.
  - wwalser 10y ago
    > Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? No. I believe it's probably true that she is compensated, in part, because of her brand which is highly associated with her dedication to working long hours. I hedged quite a lot in my OP to try and convey that this was the only part that I was confident of.
- arntatis 10y ago
  Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? Could it have been done if she worked 50% less hours? A difficult question to answer with evidence.
- arntatis 10y ago
  Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? Could it have been done if she worked 50% less hours? A difficult question to answer with evidence.
- onion2k 10y ago
  Working long hours on the basis you might be compensated if the company goes on to be worth billions is akin to buying a lottery ticket. For every Google there are thousands of examples of businesses that achieved far smaller success or failed. If you want to work long hours, do it because you enjoy the work. That way there's a reward now.
- JamesBarney 10y ago
  I was under the impression the majority of the change in stock price for Yahoo(if not all) was related to them owning a large share of Ali Baba stock which has skyrocketed in value. And this purchase was made before Marissa Mayer took over.
vidarh 10y ago
I also for a second don't believe it is productive time. I'v worked similar hours, and believed I was productive, until I had a team and saw what happened to their productivity when they worked long hours. Not just did it damage their productivity, but it killed overall team productivity, because it caused a rise in conflicts, rise in "downtime" where people were physically present and in theory working but didn't get anywhere. This might "work" for some notions of work for simple repetitive tasks where you can have someone overseeing the work and "whipping" people to keep tempo up. I have never seen it work with more than very moderate, very temporary, increases in working time, across a large number of teams over the last 20 years. In fact, I'd argue that a 40 hour week is pushing it for developers. I have my most productive weeks when I work less, and I know many who are the same.

by cup 10y ago

jjeaff 10y ago

An 8 hour work week is definitely something I can get behind.

joshmanders 10y ago
Then you'll love my ebook "1 step to working 8 hours a week and get paid $62,262/hr by Google. Number 1 is a doozy!"
- tomascot 10y ago
  Then you'll love my ebook "1 step to working 8 hours a week and get paid $62,263/hr writing ebooks!"

wwalser 10y ago

While I agree with your statement for the most part, I also understand that there is some context to it. That specific context is Marissa Mayer and other early Google employees. I find it hard to convince myself that those people and especially Mayer, were not or are not compensated in some way that takes those huge swathes of time into consideration. She was paid $36MM in 2015 and raised the market cap of Yahoo! by 151% in four years. Some of that compensation is based on success at Google, some of it may be based on her success at Yahoo!, but some of it is absolutely based on her brand. Her brand, in my own mind, is highly associated with her dedication to working long hours. I work long hours but I'm conscious of a few things: I don't celebrate it. I don't plan to proselytize it like Mayer does. Part of those long hours are dedicated to operationalizing time-sinks so that I don't have to do it forever. I don't expect others around me, especially non-founders, to do the same and like you I believe that for them to do so would likely be a net-negative.

arntatis 10y ago
Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? Could it have been done if she worked 50% less hours? A difficult question to answer with evidence.
- wwalser 10y ago
  > Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? No. I believe it's probably true that she is compensated, in part, because of her brand which is highly associated with her dedication to working long hours. I hedged quite a lot in my OP to try and convey that this was the only part that I was confident of.
arntatis 10y ago
Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? Could it have been done if she worked 50% less hours? A difficult question to answer with evidence.
arntatis 10y ago
Do you think that market cap of Yahoo was increased by 151% in four years as a direct result of the number of hours worked? Could it have been done if she worked 50% less hours? A difficult question to answer with evidence.
onion2k 10y ago
Working long hours on the basis you might be compensated if the company goes on to be worth billions is akin to buying a lottery ticket. For every Google there are thousands of examples of businesses that achieved far smaller success or failed. If you want to work long hours, do it because you enjoy the work. That way there's a reward now.
JamesBarney 10y ago
I was under the impression the majority of the change in stock price for Yahoo(if not all) was related to them owning a large share of Ali Baba stock which has skyrocketed in value. And this purchase was made before Marissa Mayer took over.

vidarh 10y ago

I also for a second don't believe it is productive time. I'v worked similar hours, and believed I was productive, until I had a team and saw what happened to their productivity when they worked long hours. Not just did it damage their productivity, but it killed overall team productivity, because it caused a rise in conflicts, rise in "downtime" where people were physically present and in theory working but didn't get anywhere. This might "work" for some notions of work for simple repetitive tasks where you can have someone overseeing the work and "whipping" people to keep tempo up. I have never seen it work with more than very moderate, very temporary, increases in working time, across a large number of teams over the last 20 years. In fact, I'd argue that a 40 hour week is pushing it for developers. I have my most productive weeks when I work less, and I know many who are the same.