4 ms·

From what I'm reading in this thread, Tk is out of the question. Poor antialiasing sounds like bad looks.

by rer 10y ago

auriocus 10y ago
I don't understand how anyone can assume that antialiasing is missing in Tk, it's simply wrong and has been there for many years for font drawing. On Linux, it must be compiled against fontconfig/xft (default, if the headers can be found). On OSX and Windows, it uses the native font renderer. The only point on OSX high dpi displays: you need to set a property that the application supports high dpi (in a .plist file), but this holds for any App-bundle on OSX. Antialiasing on a canvas (as opposed to text in labels, buttons etc.) is only enabled in OSX by default. tkpath replaces the default canvas with a more complete implementation (alpha blending, gradients, antialiasing...) on all 3 platforms.
- rer 10y ago
  Thanks so much for this! I know very little about Tk. Besides antialiasing on a canvas, does antialiasing also work in text in labels, buttons, etc? Can I get in Tk all the fonts I can get in a Mac? Is Helvetica there? Why can't I find on the web screenshots of Tk apps running on Mac OS X? Is the only way to get Tk to look good on a Mac using Tile http://tktable.sourceforge.net/tile/screenshots/macosx.html http://tktable.sourceforge.net/tile/screenshots/macosx.html ? From what I'm reading now there might be 4 options: Tk, wxWindows, QT, and a custom "thin layer".
  - networked 10y ago
    The link [5] in my top-level comment plus http://www.tkdocs.com/tutorial/fonts.html http://www.tkdocs.com/tutorial/fonts.html should answer your questions. The former has screenshots of Tk on macOS and discusses how to make it look good there. There is a screenshot of a commercial Mac application built with Tk at http://www.codebykevin.com/portauthority.html http://www.codebykevin.com/portauthority.html. Tile was integrated into Tk with version 8.5 (2007). The Tile button, label, etc. are now built in.
    - rer 10y ago
      This comment says Tk is limited https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12381978 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12381978 You and the GP say it's not. Is there anything Tk can't do? Also a question on fonts. Does Tk make it possible to use webfonts I see on websites?
      - networked 10y ago
        >You and the GP say it's not. But I did not say that. In the reply to the comment you've linked you write that "this thread believes Tk is as good as QT". I am puzzled by this conclusion because I do not see any comparison to Qt at all. Certainly, I didn't want to suggest any with my comments. If you want to know my option on how Tk compares to Qt, I currently believe that, for the most part, they serve different use cases, with some overlap in the middle. Tk is better than Qt in one area (roughly: small-to-medium applications developed by a lone hacker ASAP) and Qt is better than Tk in another (roughly: medium-to-large applications developed by a team on some sort of a schedule). Qt does a lot more than Tk. It comes with more features, e.g., networking abstractions. Compared to it, Tk is limited. Qt looks better, too — much better on *nix. I would not recommend Tk over Qt in the general, catch-all, could-become-a-kitchen-sink-application case. (In fact, working well in the general case seems to be a major selling point for Qt.) If you develop one, chances are you will find yourself wanting to do something that Tk can't. In other words, I would expect a large application to outgrow Tk before it outgrows Qt. I recommended Tk specifically for making a GUI quickly. It is good for prototyping and rapid iteration and has neat widgets like canvas and the text editor that help a lot with that. Tcl with Tk is expressive, so you can do a lot in under 1000 lines of code (toy example: [1]). The Tcl REPL helps more still, as does a great binary deployment story. After the prototype or MVP, once you understand what you want to do better, you may stay with Tk if you decide it suits your needs or switch to something else. >Is there anything Tk can't do? That is a very open-ended question. One thing that comes to mind is integrating with the host platform's accessibility features. Most cross-platform GUI toolkits suck at it. There is a wishlist wiki page [2] that might offer some hints at what other things Tk users find missing. >Does Tk make it possible to use webfonts I see on websites? Not easily. See [3]. [1] https://tcl.wiki/41294 https://tcl.wiki/41294 [2] https://tcl.wiki/4055 https://tcl.wiki/4055 [3] https://www.reddit.com/r/Tcl/comments/456ydh/is_there_a_way_to_load_a_ttf_font_file_and_use_it/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Tcl/comments/456ydh/is_there_a_way_...

From what I'm reading in this thread, Tk is out of the question. Poor antialiasing sounds like bad looks.

by rer 10y ago

From what I'm reading in this thread, Tk is out of the question. Poor antialiasing sounds like bad looks.

I don't understand how anyone can assume that antialiasing is missing in Tk, it's simply wrong and has been there for many years for font drawing. On Linux, it must be compiled against fontconfig/xft (default, if the headers can be found). On OSX and Windows, it uses the native font renderer. The only point on OSX high dpi displays: you need to set a property that the application supports high dpi (in a .plist file), but this holds for any App-bundle on OSX. Antialiasing on a canvas (as opposed to text in labels, buttons etc.) is only enabled in OSX by default. tkpath replaces the default canvas with a more complete implementation (alpha blending, gradients, antialiasing...) on all 3 platforms.

rer 10y ago
Thanks so much for this! I know very little about Tk. Besides antialiasing on a canvas, does antialiasing also work in text in labels, buttons, etc? Can I get in Tk all the fonts I can get in a Mac? Is Helvetica there? Why can't I find on the web screenshots of Tk apps running on Mac OS X? Is the only way to get Tk to look good on a Mac using Tile http://tktable.sourceforge.net/tile/screenshots/macosx.html http://tktable.sourceforge.net/tile/screenshots/macosx.html ? From what I'm reading now there might be 4 options: Tk, wxWindows, QT, and a custom "thin layer".
- networked 10y ago
  The link [5] in my top-level comment plus http://www.tkdocs.com/tutorial/fonts.html http://www.tkdocs.com/tutorial/fonts.html should answer your questions. The former has screenshots of Tk on macOS and discusses how to make it look good there. There is a screenshot of a commercial Mac application built with Tk at http://www.codebykevin.com/portauthority.html http://www.codebykevin.com/portauthority.html. Tile was integrated into Tk with version 8.5 (2007). The Tile button, label, etc. are now built in.
  - rer 10y ago
    This comment says Tk is limited https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12381978 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12381978 You and the GP say it's not. Is there anything Tk can't do? Also a question on fonts. Does Tk make it possible to use webfonts I see on websites?
    - networked 10y ago
      >You and the GP say it's not. But I did not say that. In the reply to the comment you've linked you write that "this thread believes Tk is as good as QT". I am puzzled by this conclusion because I do not see any comparison to Qt at all. Certainly, I didn't want to suggest any with my comments. If you want to know my option on how Tk compares to Qt, I currently believe that, for the most part, they serve different use cases, with some overlap in the middle. Tk is better than Qt in one area (roughly: small-to-medium applications developed by a lone hacker ASAP) and Qt is better than Tk in another (roughly: medium-to-large applications developed by a team on some sort of a schedule). Qt does a lot more than Tk. It comes with more features, e.g., networking abstractions. Compared to it, Tk is limited. Qt looks better, too — much better on *nix. I would not recommend Tk over Qt in the general, catch-all, could-become-a-kitchen-sink-application case. (In fact, working well in the general case seems to be a major selling point for Qt.) If you develop one, chances are you will find yourself wanting to do something that Tk can't. In other words, I would expect a large application to outgrow Tk before it outgrows Qt. I recommended Tk specifically for making a GUI quickly. It is good for prototyping and rapid iteration and has neat widgets like canvas and the text editor that help a lot with that. Tcl with Tk is expressive, so you can do a lot in under 1000 lines of code (toy example: [1]). The Tcl REPL helps more still, as does a great binary deployment story. After the prototype or MVP, once you understand what you want to do better, you may stay with Tk if you decide it suits your needs or switch to something else. >Is there anything Tk can't do? That is a very open-ended question. One thing that comes to mind is integrating with the host platform's accessibility features. Most cross-platform GUI toolkits suck at it. There is a wishlist wiki page [2] that might offer some hints at what other things Tk users find missing. >Does Tk make it possible to use webfonts I see on websites? Not easily. See [3]. [1] https://tcl.wiki/41294 https://tcl.wiki/41294 [2] https://tcl.wiki/4055 https://tcl.wiki/4055 [3] https://www.reddit.com/r/Tcl/comments/456ydh/is_there_a_way_to_load_a_ttf_font_file_and_use_it/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Tcl/comments/456ydh/is_there_a_way_...