5 ms·

Gabriel accused Washington of being "angry" about the deal that the EU struck with Canada, known as CETA, because it contains elements the U.S. doesn't want to

by ced 10y ago

Gabriel accused Washington of being "angry" about the deal that the EU struck with Canada, known as CETA, because it contains elements the U.S. doesn't want to see in the TTIP. What would those elements be?

the_mitsuhiko 10y ago
Very light on investor protections and retains a lot of the EU regulations to be kept. In particular about food safety and similar things.
- majewsky 10y ago
  But why does it matter that these are not part of TTIP? If CETA is signed into law and includes those regulations, then US companies can just route their business with the EU through their Canadian branches and get the same benefits. (Unless, of course, European parliaments discover some leftover spine in their bodies and vote against CETA.)
  - celticninja 10y ago
    The US want their companies to have to adhere to less regulation not more. So essentially there are things in CETA that require Canadian companies to meet more a higher criteria with regard to food safety when trading with the EU. The US doesn't want to meet these higher criteria, a US firm selling to the EU through a Canadian branch would have to meet these higher criteria, which means that the US company would either have to forego selling to the EU or increase food safety standards across the board (they could just do it for export goods but that seems a bit silly) either way the companies costs increase. Evidently you thought that TTIP was some kind of reasonable deal for all parties however it is mainly beneficial to some large US corporations at the expense of the citizens everywhere.
    - majewsky 10y ago
      > Evidently you thought that TTIP was some kind of reasonable deal for all parties however it is mainly beneficial to some large US corporations at the expense of the citizens everywhere. To the contrary. I have attended quite some anti-TTIP rallies myself. My suspicion is that what we're seeing right now was the strategy all along: The European opposition (both inside and outside the parliaments) focused on TTIP because the US is an easier enemy (with all the latent anti-americanism boiling all over Europe). So the government(s) are now dropping TTIP very loudly, and while the public feels appeased, CETA is silently signed into law.
      - celticninja 10y ago
        CETA, as far as I understand, is much less controversial than TTIP mainly because it is somewhat more fair to both sides, as opposed to the lopsidedness of the TTIP in favour of US corporations. In addition the text is easily available for people to read and review, unlike TTIP. However as I understand it the controversial ISDS remains however this may cause it to not be ratified by some EU nations.
  - josteink 10y ago
    > but why does it matter that these are not part of TTIP? If CETA The tinfoil hat summary is that the US is trying to push through its own policies worldwide, one dominated by lack of regulation, lack of work protection and lots of protection for investors and people with money. If they would be able to strick similar deals worldwide, US companies would be able to move production to wherever it is cheap, and no workers right exist, while having the investors money covered in case the corrupt dictatorships screws them over. Any new deal signed which mandates workers right, environmental protections, and doesn't put investor-money above human lives, is detrimental to this global power-grab effort.
    - mathiasrw 10y ago
      > The tinfoil hat summary is that the US is trying to push through its own policies worldwide There is no tinfoil hat about that...
    - nickff 10y ago
      Many regulations are introduced with the implicit purpose of disadvantaging foreigners; one example of this would be Chinese restrictions on importations of electronics (similar to European RoHS, but more stringent and only applied to foreigners). Regulations are often introduced to advantage large, coherent interests such as unions and industries.
_of 10y ago
I wonder what those elements are?

by ced 10y ago

the_mitsuhiko 10y ago

Very light on investor protections and retains a lot of the EU regulations to be kept. In particular about food safety and similar things.

majewsky 10y ago
But why does it matter that these are not part of TTIP? If CETA is signed into law and includes those regulations, then US companies can just route their business with the EU through their Canadian branches and get the same benefits. (Unless, of course, European parliaments discover some leftover spine in their bodies and vote against CETA.)
- celticninja 10y ago
  The US want their companies to have to adhere to less regulation not more. So essentially there are things in CETA that require Canadian companies to meet more a higher criteria with regard to food safety when trading with the EU. The US doesn't want to meet these higher criteria, a US firm selling to the EU through a Canadian branch would have to meet these higher criteria, which means that the US company would either have to forego selling to the EU or increase food safety standards across the board (they could just do it for export goods but that seems a bit silly) either way the companies costs increase. Evidently you thought that TTIP was some kind of reasonable deal for all parties however it is mainly beneficial to some large US corporations at the expense of the citizens everywhere.
  - majewsky 10y ago
    > Evidently you thought that TTIP was some kind of reasonable deal for all parties however it is mainly beneficial to some large US corporations at the expense of the citizens everywhere. To the contrary. I have attended quite some anti-TTIP rallies myself. My suspicion is that what we're seeing right now was the strategy all along: The European opposition (both inside and outside the parliaments) focused on TTIP because the US is an easier enemy (with all the latent anti-americanism boiling all over Europe). So the government(s) are now dropping TTIP very loudly, and while the public feels appeased, CETA is silently signed into law.
    - celticninja 10y ago
      CETA, as far as I understand, is much less controversial than TTIP mainly because it is somewhat more fair to both sides, as opposed to the lopsidedness of the TTIP in favour of US corporations. In addition the text is easily available for people to read and review, unlike TTIP. However as I understand it the controversial ISDS remains however this may cause it to not be ratified by some EU nations.
- josteink 10y ago
  > but why does it matter that these are not part of TTIP? If CETA The tinfoil hat summary is that the US is trying to push through its own policies worldwide, one dominated by lack of regulation, lack of work protection and lots of protection for investors and people with money. If they would be able to strick similar deals worldwide, US companies would be able to move production to wherever it is cheap, and no workers right exist, while having the investors money covered in case the corrupt dictatorships screws them over. Any new deal signed which mandates workers right, environmental protections, and doesn't put investor-money above human lives, is detrimental to this global power-grab effort.
  - mathiasrw 10y ago
    > The tinfoil hat summary is that the US is trying to push through its own policies worldwide There is no tinfoil hat about that...
  - nickff 10y ago
    Many regulations are introduced with the implicit purpose of disadvantaging foreigners; one example of this would be Chinese restrictions on importations of electronics (similar to European RoHS, but more stringent and only applied to foreigners). Regulations are often introduced to advantage large, coherent interests such as unions and industries.

_of 10y ago

I wonder what those elements are?