5 ms·

"which would not only bring about a more efficient and frictionless market (I.e. Simple cross-border trade for services and products), but also ultimately eleva

"which would not only bring about a more efficient and frictionless market (I.e. Simple cross-border trade for services and products), but also ultimately elevate the standard of living for all citizens." But you would have to have a working culture that is similar, which is not the case in the EU. People in Spain don't work like people in France or Germany, their government are different and wanting to have a single fiscal policy is doomed to fail. Also, the 1 to 5 salary for entry level workers is killing entry level workers in Western Europe, and that's one of the reasons behind so much euroskepticism

madaxe_again 10y ago
And the money returns to their home state, which increases wealth, which increases consumption, which increases prices, which increases salaries. Again, it's a question of looking at the bigger picture rather than the immediate situation.
- blibble 10y ago
  it's all very well to say "wait 30 years", however the Italian/Spanish/Greek governments will realise at some point that their young citizens will not permit them to sacrifice their life chances in their 20s/30s/40s so that Eastern Europe can increase its GDP
  - madaxe_again 10y ago
    Or they'll wait them out. As we've seen in Britain, older voters who aren't feeling the pain in the same way will remain a dominant force for a good 20-30 years yet. That said, many are voting with their feet - those reviled eastern states are havens for mobile youth, particularly those versed in technology. I also don't think 30 years is the timescale. It's more like ten, given the already accelerating pace of growth in previously impoverished states. Do look at gdp per cap graphs for, say, Latvia. It's impressive. The financial crash hurt, but they're already back on a healthy sigmoid upramp. https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=latvia+gdp+per+capita&rlz=1CDGOYI_enGB590GB590&oq=latbia+gdp+&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0l3.4099j0j8&hl=en-GB&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=latvia+gdp+per+capita&rlz=...
    - thatfrenchguy 10y ago
      It's been ten years and the trend has been darkening for people in Western Europe. In my low-middle class family there has been noticeable cases of factories or offices moving to Eastern Europe (Poland notably), and it is fueling extreme right wing parties, for good reasons. You can talk about "mobile youth", but learning French when you're a low class Czech person is not something that's easy: the mobility in the EU is very restricted for that reason.

madaxe_again 10y ago

And the money returns to their home state, which increases wealth, which increases consumption, which increases prices, which increases salaries. Again, it's a question of looking at the bigger picture rather than the immediate situation.

blibble 10y ago
it's all very well to say "wait 30 years", however the Italian/Spanish/Greek governments will realise at some point that their young citizens will not permit them to sacrifice their life chances in their 20s/30s/40s so that Eastern Europe can increase its GDP
- madaxe_again 10y ago
  Or they'll wait them out. As we've seen in Britain, older voters who aren't feeling the pain in the same way will remain a dominant force for a good 20-30 years yet. That said, many are voting with their feet - those reviled eastern states are havens for mobile youth, particularly those versed in technology. I also don't think 30 years is the timescale. It's more like ten, given the already accelerating pace of growth in previously impoverished states. Do look at gdp per cap graphs for, say, Latvia. It's impressive. The financial crash hurt, but they're already back on a healthy sigmoid upramp. https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=latvia+gdp+per+capita&rlz=1CDGOYI_enGB590GB590&oq=latbia+gdp+&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0l3.4099j0j8&hl=en-GB&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=latvia+gdp+per+capita&rlz=...
  - thatfrenchguy 10y ago
    It's been ten years and the trend has been darkening for people in Western Europe. In my low-middle class family there has been noticeable cases of factories or offices moving to Eastern Europe (Poland notably), and it is fueling extreme right wing parties, for good reasons. You can talk about "mobile youth", but learning French when you're a low class Czech person is not something that's easy: the mobility in the EU is very restricted for that reason.