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Working your butt off has zero to do with having a executable vision that creates value. Clearly shit needs to get done, but there's only so many hours in the

by nxzero 10y ago

Working your butt off has zero to do with having a executable vision that creates value. Clearly shit needs to get done, but there's only so many hours in the a life of a startup and being able to see what needs to be done ultimately is more important than just getting stuff done. __ "I choose a lazy person to do a hard job. Because a lazy person will find an easy way to do it." - Bill Gates

amorphid 10y ago
I do not agree. A person who doesn't work their butt off usually lacks any sort of meaningful perspective derived from hard work.
- nxzero 10y ago
  "A shortcut is not shortcut, unless you know the way." - nxzero Finding shortcuts does not require hard work, but a willingness to be different and take risks others will not.
  - amorphid 10y ago
    "Someone else already knows the trade secret for the problem I'm trying to solve, but they won't tell me the solution, because I don't have lots of money. Even if they did tell me, I probably wouldn't understand it, because I lack the perspective of experience." -amorphid "I have no idea in which direction I need to go, so I'm gonna have to work my butt off to find the right path." -amorphid "I worked really hard, and found a solution!" -amorphid
rsp1984 10y ago
Oh, I agree that a startup needs an executable vision. However if someone provides just the vision but doesn't put as much work in as everybody else that's an advisory role, not a co-founder role, and should be reflected in the equity distribution. The thing is that vision is just so much easier than actually doing the grinding grunt work. "Vision without execution is hallucination" - Thomas Edison
- nxzero 10y ago
  Disagree. I've literally run a startup where I took an opportunity I saw, pitched it to a cofounder, got a single client, cofounder did all the work. After year, cofounder was tried of doing work, so I told them how to turn the service into a product and rapidly got five clients; after that, the cofounder didn't have to do anymore work either. I'm not lazy, happy to do hard work, but if I see an exploitable situation I will not create work just to feel good about things. Do exactly what needs to be done, nothing less, nothing more. Footnote: Not a fan of Edison, he in fact was lazy, refused to change, and spent a good deal of his life literally pounding rock to no end.
  - leesalminen 10y ago
    Why would you exploit your cofounder into performing a disproportionate amount of work?
    - nxzero 10y ago
      I didn't exploit the cofounder, I presented them with an opportunity, they were fully aware of the situation. In fact, they were excited about the project, enjoyed the work, and often bragged about it to our friends. Beyond that, after I told him how to turn the service into a product, I turn something that without me would have had no value after they stopped into something that produced value for years without any major effort from either of us. EDIT: Truly curious as to the reasoning behind the downvotes and would welcome a comment expressing someone's thoughts on why this comment has received 3+ downvotes.
      - Alain-lf 10y ago
        You are getting downvoted because you look like someone full of themselves. You admit you did nothing... and that your cofounder did everything... but you refuse to attribute the success of the startup to your cofounder and instead attribute the success to yourself. You have the audacity to claim that the startup would have been worthless without you, but ignore the fact it wouldn't even exist without your cofounder. Plus you quote yourself.
brahmwg 10y ago
I get what you're saying, and i think the whole "you gotta work your butt off to be successful" thing is a lingering noting from workoholic culture. "How many hours you put in?" is the corporate version of "how much can you lift?" And I believe it's not exactly right; working smarter is better than just working harder. But both do entail work. Then again, isn't there some quote about inspiration and perspiration ;)
- hvo 10y ago
  Well, here is this about Bill Gates coding 18hrs a day in his first job. http://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2015/10/bill-gates-first-real-job/409084/ http://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2015/10/bill-gates-first-re...
  - krmboya 10y ago
    Very interesting. Perhaps if he'd managed to skip undergraduate studies straight to graduate school as adviced he'd be wrestling with hard enough problems not to think about writing programs for the upcoming PCs of the era
- jomamaxx 10y ago
  "you gotta work your butt off to be successful" thing is a lingering noting from workaholic culture. " Completely false. There are very, very few startups that are successful wherein the founders are not putting in crazy hours.
jomamaxx 10y ago
"Working your butt off has zero to do with having a executable vision that creates value." Except that 'working your butt of has everything to do with actually executing that vision' Google, FB, Apple, MS - founders 100% of these companies worked really, really hard to get there. Bill Gates was notorious for pushing his people to extremes.
sharemywin 10y ago
The thing you missing is leadership. People won't bust there ass off over and above what they are paid for a lazy person that looks to exploit them. But, if you can work your ass off and have a vision people want to follow with a whole lot of luck you might create something special.

by nxzero 10y ago

amorphid 10y ago

I do not agree. A person who doesn't work their butt off usually lacks any sort of meaningful perspective derived from hard work.

nxzero 10y ago
"A shortcut is not shortcut, unless you know the way." - nxzero Finding shortcuts does not require hard work, but a willingness to be different and take risks others will not.
- amorphid 10y ago
  "Someone else already knows the trade secret for the problem I'm trying to solve, but they won't tell me the solution, because I don't have lots of money. Even if they did tell me, I probably wouldn't understand it, because I lack the perspective of experience." -amorphid "I have no idea in which direction I need to go, so I'm gonna have to work my butt off to find the right path." -amorphid "I worked really hard, and found a solution!" -amorphid

rsp1984 10y ago

Oh, I agree that a startup needs an executable vision. However if someone provides just the vision but doesn't put as much work in as everybody else that's an advisory role, not a co-founder role, and should be reflected in the equity distribution. The thing is that vision is just so much easier than actually doing the grinding grunt work. "Vision without execution is hallucination" - Thomas Edison

nxzero 10y ago
Disagree. I've literally run a startup where I took an opportunity I saw, pitched it to a cofounder, got a single client, cofounder did all the work. After year, cofounder was tried of doing work, so I told them how to turn the service into a product and rapidly got five clients; after that, the cofounder didn't have to do anymore work either. I'm not lazy, happy to do hard work, but if I see an exploitable situation I will not create work just to feel good about things. Do exactly what needs to be done, nothing less, nothing more. Footnote: Not a fan of Edison, he in fact was lazy, refused to change, and spent a good deal of his life literally pounding rock to no end.
- leesalminen 10y ago
  Why would you exploit your cofounder into performing a disproportionate amount of work?
  - nxzero 10y ago
    I didn't exploit the cofounder, I presented them with an opportunity, they were fully aware of the situation. In fact, they were excited about the project, enjoyed the work, and often bragged about it to our friends. Beyond that, after I told him how to turn the service into a product, I turn something that without me would have had no value after they stopped into something that produced value for years without any major effort from either of us. EDIT: Truly curious as to the reasoning behind the downvotes and would welcome a comment expressing someone's thoughts on why this comment has received 3+ downvotes.
    - Alain-lf 10y ago
      You are getting downvoted because you look like someone full of themselves. You admit you did nothing... and that your cofounder did everything... but you refuse to attribute the success of the startup to your cofounder and instead attribute the success to yourself. You have the audacity to claim that the startup would have been worthless without you, but ignore the fact it wouldn't even exist without your cofounder. Plus you quote yourself.

brahmwg 10y ago

I get what you're saying, and i think the whole "you gotta work your butt off to be successful" thing is a lingering noting from workoholic culture. "How many hours you put in?" is the corporate version of "how much can you lift?" And I believe it's not exactly right; working smarter is better than just working harder. But both do entail work. Then again, isn't there some quote about inspiration and perspiration ;)

hvo 10y ago
Well, here is this about Bill Gates coding 18hrs a day in his first job. http://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2015/10/bill-gates-first-real-job/409084/ http://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2015/10/bill-gates-first-re...
- krmboya 10y ago
  Very interesting. Perhaps if he'd managed to skip undergraduate studies straight to graduate school as adviced he'd be wrestling with hard enough problems not to think about writing programs for the upcoming PCs of the era
jomamaxx 10y ago
"you gotta work your butt off to be successful" thing is a lingering noting from workaholic culture. " Completely false. There are very, very few startups that are successful wherein the founders are not putting in crazy hours.

jomamaxx 10y ago

"Working your butt off has zero to do with having a executable vision that creates value." Except that 'working your butt of has everything to do with actually executing that vision' Google, FB, Apple, MS - founders 100% of these companies worked really, really hard to get there. Bill Gates was notorious for pushing his people to extremes.

sharemywin 10y ago

The thing you missing is leadership. People won't bust there ass off over and above what they are paid for a lazy person that looks to exploit them. But, if you can work your ass off and have a vision people want to follow with a whole lot of luck you might create something special.