4 ms·

I thought Monk already did a pretty good job of extending Sinatra without going overboard. http://monkrb.com/ http://monkrb.com/ I'd be interested to know how

by gurop 17y ago

I thought Monk already did a pretty good job of extending Sinatra without going overboard. http://monkrb.com/ http://monkrb.com/ I'd be interested to know how Padrino compares to Monk. At first glance Padrino seems closer to Rails in scale - which seems to defeat the whole minimalist mindset behind Sinatra. I mean, if I want Rails, I'll use Rails. The extensive community support for Rails in combination with the improvements in Rails 3 already makes it difficult to justify using a smaller framework like Sinatra. Many of the questions I have asked in the Sinatra community have gone unanswered so I imagine using Padrino (or even Monk) would simply add to that problem. On the other hand, with Rails, the combination of StackOverflow, Google Groups and a plethora of Googleble web resources means you are never far from resolving a holdup.

jmonegro 17y ago
The thing about monk is that you can use each particular section individually on Sinatra as well. IMO, this is a simpler rails that works the way I like it.
- gurop 17y ago
  Rails 3 is a simpler Rails that works the way I like it. But with the added advantage of massive community support. Sinatra (and Ramaze) also have the advantage of having been thoroughly tested and have a lot of eyeballs on them. Using Padrino (and perhaps Monk) creates the risk of (a) encountering framework boilerplate code that is buggy and (b) not having enough help to fix those problems because of insufficient resources on the part of the creators or insufficient community support. That said, the documentation is impressive and attractive. The only suggestion I would make is the reduce the size of the downloadable screencast - no need for a 210MB video file for 12 minutes of video. Also, the version on Vimeo is unwatchable because it's not HD - it's difficult to read the source code on screen.
  - tptacek 17y ago
    No idea why anyone would mod this comment down. For what it's worth, I agree completely.
  - jmonegro 17y ago
    But is it as fast?
  - nesquena 17y ago
    I agree Vimeo version was unwatchable. We have uploaded a better version to blip.tv here: http://blip.tv/file/3432970/ http://blip.tv/file/3432970/ and updated our blog tutorial to reflect this: http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/blog-tutorial http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/blog-tutorial . Also thanks for your feedback.
- achiu 17y ago
  Padrino allows you to also cherry-pick any 'section' as well. check out the doc here http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/standalone-usage-in-sinatra http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/standalone-usage-in-sinatra
nesquena 17y ago
Padrino developer here. I also like monkrb but if you check out the Padrino guides (http://www.padrinorb.com/guides http://www.padrinorb.com/guides) you will see that Padrino is quite a bit more full-featured but also modular. You can enable / disable various features of Padrino and even include certain pieces in existing Sinatra apps. Our team has used Rails and Sinatra both extensively for contract work and I would argue if you give Padrino + Sinatra a try that you will find it does not defeat the mentality of Sinatra. Instead Padrino simply complements the existing feature set with optional enhancements you might frequently need such as form helpers, tag helpers, localization, mailers and more. I agree that community support for Sinatra and Padrino are considerably lacking in comparison to Rails. I don't think this is something that cannot be fixed however. Sinatra has only recently hit 1.0 stable which means that the community has just begun to grow. I can say our team at least is committed to helping anyone with problems associated with Sinatra/Padrino. Feel free to post any issues here: http://github.com/padrino/padrino-framework/issues http://github.com/padrino/padrino-framework/issues if you find any specific problems. Thanks guys!
RattaPack 17y ago
Sorry but guys, Monk is NOT a framework but a skeleton generator: http://github.com/monkrb/monk/blob/master/lib/monk.rb http://github.com/monkrb/monk/blob/master/lib/monk.rb Now if you look some sources of padrino... you can see that is something more. Comparaisons are good but please compare with some thing similar!
- nesquena 17y ago
  Thanks for pointing that out RattaPack. We have actually recently released a blog post addressing some concerns we have noticed since our release here: http://www.padrinorb.com/blog/addressing-concerns-about-padrino http://www.padrinorb.com/blog/addressing-concerns-about-padr... . Hope that helps clarify certain things about our framework!

by gurop 17y ago

jmonegro 17y ago

The thing about monk is that you can use each particular section individually on Sinatra as well. IMO, this is a simpler rails that works the way I like it.

gurop 17y ago
Rails 3 is a simpler Rails that works the way I like it. But with the added advantage of massive community support. Sinatra (and Ramaze) also have the advantage of having been thoroughly tested and have a lot of eyeballs on them. Using Padrino (and perhaps Monk) creates the risk of (a) encountering framework boilerplate code that is buggy and (b) not having enough help to fix those problems because of insufficient resources on the part of the creators or insufficient community support. That said, the documentation is impressive and attractive. The only suggestion I would make is the reduce the size of the downloadable screencast - no need for a 210MB video file for 12 minutes of video. Also, the version on Vimeo is unwatchable because it's not HD - it's difficult to read the source code on screen.
- tptacek 17y ago
  No idea why anyone would mod this comment down. For what it's worth, I agree completely.
- jmonegro 17y ago
  But is it as fast?
- nesquena 17y ago
  I agree Vimeo version was unwatchable. We have uploaded a better version to blip.tv here: http://blip.tv/file/3432970/ http://blip.tv/file/3432970/ and updated our blog tutorial to reflect this: http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/blog-tutorial http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/blog-tutorial . Also thanks for your feedback.
achiu 17y ago
Padrino allows you to also cherry-pick any 'section' as well. check out the doc here http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/standalone-usage-in-sinatra http://www.padrinorb.com/guides/standalone-usage-in-sinatra

nesquena 17y ago

Padrino developer here. I also like monkrb but if you check out the Padrino guides (http://www.padrinorb.com/guides http://www.padrinorb.com/guides) you will see that Padrino is quite a bit more full-featured but also modular. You can enable / disable various features of Padrino and even include certain pieces in existing Sinatra apps. Our team has used Rails and Sinatra both extensively for contract work and I would argue if you give Padrino + Sinatra a try that you will find it does not defeat the mentality of Sinatra. Instead Padrino simply complements the existing feature set with optional enhancements you might frequently need such as form helpers, tag helpers, localization, mailers and more. I agree that community support for Sinatra and Padrino are considerably lacking in comparison to Rails. I don't think this is something that cannot be fixed however. Sinatra has only recently hit 1.0 stable which means that the community has just begun to grow. I can say our team at least is committed to helping anyone with problems associated with Sinatra/Padrino. Feel free to post any issues here: http://github.com/padrino/padrino-framework/issues http://github.com/padrino/padrino-framework/issues if you find any specific problems. Thanks guys!

RattaPack 17y ago

Sorry but guys, Monk is NOT a framework but a skeleton generator: http://github.com/monkrb/monk/blob/master/lib/monk.rb http://github.com/monkrb/monk/blob/master/lib/monk.rb Now if you look some sources of padrino... you can see that is something more. Comparaisons are good but please compare with some thing similar!

nesquena 17y ago
Thanks for pointing that out RattaPack. We have actually recently released a blog post addressing some concerns we have noticed since our release here: http://www.padrinorb.com/blog/addressing-concerns-about-padrino http://www.padrinorb.com/blog/addressing-concerns-about-padr... . Hope that helps clarify certain things about our framework!