4 ms·

It's a different school of thought IMHO. In Europe, prisons are more focused on rehabilitation, whereas US prisons are more focused on punishment. This can al

It's a different school of thought IMHO. In Europe, prisons are more focused on rehabilitation, whereas US prisons are more focused on punishment. This can also be seen in the different sentences. Whereas in Norway (maximum sentence 21 years) or Germany (mostly out of prison after 15 years), you can be sentenced for life or even death in the US. It obviously works out more expensive and doesn't seem really fair, but bad people must be punished!!1

masklinn 10y ago
> This can also be seen in the different sentences. Whereas in Norway (maximum sentence 21 years) or Germany (mostly out of prison after 15 years), you can be sentenced for life or even death in the US. Things are not that clear cut, you can't get "hard" sentenced to life (or death) in Norway but you can be sentenced to indeterminate-length "preventive detention": the sentence can be renewed for up to 5 years at a time indefinitely.
- jpatokal 10y ago
  But those sentences are extremely rare and reserved for violent psychopaths. Norway currently has 76 people serving one. In the US, it's possible and not even that rare to end up with life sentences for things like non-violent drugs offenses and repeated petty theft (three strikes), so there are >150,000 people with actual life sentences. Plus all the people serving something like 80 years, which is notionally definite, but in practice also a life sentence.
  - toomanybeersies 10y ago
    I linked this just the other day, and it's relevant again. Life in prison for stealing a pair of socks: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/cruel-and-unusual-punishment-the-shame-of-three-strikes-laws-20130327 http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/cruel-and-unusual-... If that's not manifestly unjust, I don't know what is. I have no idea how 3 strikes laws and mandatory minimums are constitutional in the USA, I'm no constitutional scholar (or American), but I'm fairly sure that it violates separation of powers. Regardless, the above link is a very good reason for judicial discretion, among other reasons.
coldtea 10y ago
>In Europe, prisons are more focused on rehabilitation, whereas US prisons are more focused on punishment. It's because American at its core is the place built by descendants of the religious nuts that were rightfully thrown out of Europe. As for new immigrants, they usually just adopt the prevalent national ideology...
skrebbel 10y ago
> In Europe, prisons are more focused on rehabilitation, whereas US prisons are more focused on punishment. Not all of Europe. Here in the Netherlands we have the high security prison in Vught where there are no guards during airing time. So the guards put all kinds of nutters, murderers, and psychopaths in a big field together, lock all the gates, and stand on the other side looking. If bad happens, sorry can't do something about it, wouldn't be safe for the guards. I'm deeply ashamed of this. We Dutch like to be so enlightened and moralistic but this sort of shit really kills it. We need to adopt the Norwegian system.

masklinn 10y ago

> This can also be seen in the different sentences. Whereas in Norway (maximum sentence 21 years) or Germany (mostly out of prison after 15 years), you can be sentenced for life or even death in the US. Things are not that clear cut, you can't get "hard" sentenced to life (or death) in Norway but you can be sentenced to indeterminate-length "preventive detention": the sentence can be renewed for up to 5 years at a time indefinitely.

jpatokal 10y ago
But those sentences are extremely rare and reserved for violent psychopaths. Norway currently has 76 people serving one. In the US, it's possible and not even that rare to end up with life sentences for things like non-violent drugs offenses and repeated petty theft (three strikes), so there are >150,000 people with actual life sentences. Plus all the people serving something like 80 years, which is notionally definite, but in practice also a life sentence.
- toomanybeersies 10y ago
  I linked this just the other day, and it's relevant again. Life in prison for stealing a pair of socks: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/cruel-and-unusual-punishment-the-shame-of-three-strikes-laws-20130327 http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/cruel-and-unusual-... If that's not manifestly unjust, I don't know what is. I have no idea how 3 strikes laws and mandatory minimums are constitutional in the USA, I'm no constitutional scholar (or American), but I'm fairly sure that it violates separation of powers. Regardless, the above link is a very good reason for judicial discretion, among other reasons.

coldtea 10y ago

>In Europe, prisons are more focused on rehabilitation, whereas US prisons are more focused on punishment. It's because American at its core is the place built by descendants of the religious nuts that were rightfully thrown out of Europe. As for new immigrants, they usually just adopt the prevalent national ideology...

skrebbel 10y ago

> In Europe, prisons are more focused on rehabilitation, whereas US prisons are more focused on punishment. Not all of Europe. Here in the Netherlands we have the high security prison in Vught where there are no guards during airing time. So the guards put all kinds of nutters, murderers, and psychopaths in a big field together, lock all the gates, and stand on the other side looking. If bad happens, sorry can't do something about it, wouldn't be safe for the guards. I'm deeply ashamed of this. We Dutch like to be so enlightened and moralistic but this sort of shit really kills it. We need to adopt the Norwegian system.