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The healthcare system in countries like France, Canada, Germany is much more efficient and provides better healthcare to most of it's citizens than the US healt

The healthcare system in countries like France, Canada, Germany is much more efficient and provides better healthcare to most of it's citizens than the US healthcare system pre and post obamacare. https://www.oecd.org/eco/growth/46508904.pdf https://www.oecd.org/eco/growth/46508904.pdf http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/2014/jun/us-health-system-ranks-last http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/...

bcohen5055 10y ago
*citations needed
- marxidad 10y ago
  http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2011/09/20/medicare-is-more-efficient-than-private-insurance/ http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2011/09/20/medicare-is-more-ef...
- sp332 10y ago
  I was going to post this graph https://twitter.com/paulg/status/762920971078627328 https://twitter.com/paulg/status/762920971078627328 but in searching for a source I found the conversation underneath was more interesting. (For reference the source was https://ourworldindata.org/life-expectancy/ https://ourworldindata.org/life-expectancy/ and it's interactive.)
- njkanjsd 10y ago
  http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/2014/jun/us-health-system-ranks-last http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/...
vidarh 10y ago
Germany is mixed private/public insurance. EDIT: So does France.
- danielweber 10y ago
  All those countries are very different. There's this cartoon understanding the health care system, where the US has system A, and every other country in the world has system B. You will find people on both sides of the aisle believing this. Even though Germany is closer to the US than it is to France.
  - vidarh 10y ago
    The big difference with respect to Germany, though, is that they are not afraid to regulate their health sector. The problem with the US model is not so much private vs. public, but a matter of lobbyists and ideology getting in the way of regulating it in the way that makes sense for people instead of for healthcare providers and insurers. (France also has a mix of private and public healthcare insurance)
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
X86BSD 10y ago
Yeah I'm not buying this and never have. You're going to need to cite some kind of scientific statistics or stats or studies. When people get sick they come to the US for treatment if they can. You don't see world leaders and those with money going to Canada or Europe for treatment. Not when it's dire. The US is hella expensive for many reasons one is that we have the most bleeding edge medical technology.
- danielweber 10y ago
  > You're going to need to cite some kind of scientific statistics or stats or studies. There are plenty of studies that support his position. But there are also lots of studies that oppose his position. And everyone will listen to the studies that support their prior viewpoint and say that the others are bunk. You could have a good debate about health care if everyone gave up their priors, was willing to listen to opposing evidence, and was willing to accept their preferred system has real honest-to-God not-said-sarcastically tradeoffs. Let us know when that happens.
- njkanjsd 10y ago
  Here you go: http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/2014/jun/us-health-system-ranks-last http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/... You can find other articles and studies echoing the same conclusions. > When people get sick they come to the US for treatment if they can. No they don't. And many Americans go to other countries for treatment because they can't afford it in the US. > You don't see world leaders and those with money going to Canada or Europe for treatment. 'Those with money' is a tiny portion of the population, which is why I said 'most citizens' get better healthcare in other countries (developed ones). > The US is hella expensive for many reasons one is that we have the most bleeding edge medical technology. Not really, US has some bleeding edge medicine, not the best for every aspect of health, and the bleeding edge stuff is only available to a very tiny portion of the population.
  - X86BSD 10y ago
    reading those now.

bcohen5055 10y ago

*citations needed

marxidad 10y ago
http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2011/09/20/medicare-is-more-efficient-than-private-insurance/ http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2011/09/20/medicare-is-more-ef...
sp332 10y ago
I was going to post this graph https://twitter.com/paulg/status/762920971078627328 https://twitter.com/paulg/status/762920971078627328 but in searching for a source I found the conversation underneath was more interesting. (For reference the source was https://ourworldindata.org/life-expectancy/ https://ourworldindata.org/life-expectancy/ and it's interactive.)
njkanjsd 10y ago
http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/2014/jun/us-health-system-ranks-last http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/...

vidarh 10y ago

Germany is mixed private/public insurance. EDIT: So does France.

danielweber 10y ago
All those countries are very different. There's this cartoon understanding the health care system, where the US has system A, and every other country in the world has system B. You will find people on both sides of the aisle believing this. Even though Germany is closer to the US than it is to France.
- vidarh 10y ago
  The big difference with respect to Germany, though, is that they are not afraid to regulate their health sector. The problem with the US model is not so much private vs. public, but a matter of lobbyists and ideology getting in the way of regulating it in the way that makes sense for people instead of for healthcare providers and insurers. (France also has a mix of private and public healthcare insurance)

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

X86BSD 10y ago

Yeah I'm not buying this and never have. You're going to need to cite some kind of scientific statistics or stats or studies. When people get sick they come to the US for treatment if they can. You don't see world leaders and those with money going to Canada or Europe for treatment. Not when it's dire. The US is hella expensive for many reasons one is that we have the most bleeding edge medical technology.

danielweber 10y ago
> You're going to need to cite some kind of scientific statistics or stats or studies. There are plenty of studies that support his position. But there are also lots of studies that oppose his position. And everyone will listen to the studies that support their prior viewpoint and say that the others are bunk. You could have a good debate about health care if everyone gave up their priors, was willing to listen to opposing evidence, and was willing to accept their preferred system has real honest-to-God not-said-sarcastically tradeoffs. Let us know when that happens.
njkanjsd 10y ago
Here you go: http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/2014/jun/us-health-system-ranks-last http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/press-releases/... You can find other articles and studies echoing the same conclusions. > When people get sick they come to the US for treatment if they can. No they don't. And many Americans go to other countries for treatment because they can't afford it in the US. > You don't see world leaders and those with money going to Canada or Europe for treatment. 'Those with money' is a tiny portion of the population, which is why I said 'most citizens' get better healthcare in other countries (developed ones). > The US is hella expensive for many reasons one is that we have the most bleeding edge medical technology. Not really, US has some bleeding edge medicine, not the best for every aspect of health, and the bleeding edge stuff is only available to a very tiny portion of the population.
- X86BSD 10y ago
  reading those now.