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There is no point in making any 'case' about climate, because it is not a matter which can be resolved by argument. Some people believe in global warming, other

There is no point in making any 'case' about climate, because it is not a matter which can be resolved by argument. Some people believe in global warming, others don't. That's all there is to it. It is not a matter of science. Why not? Because it is not accepted as a matter of science, by those who don't think it is a matter of science. It is not a matter of evidence. Why not? Because there is no universally accepted evidence. Attitudes to global warming are irreducible essential beliefs, and therefore not amenable to any form of argument.

Nursie 10y ago
This is nonsense, years of scientific evidence and argument have overturned a lot of 'denialist' canards and made acceptance of the science much more widespread, including getting most western governments on board with it to various extents. Those with a religious zeal (in either direction) are a minority.
- sevenless 10y ago
  Climate change is an ideology. Terms like 'denialist' and 'warmist' indicate the ideological nature of the climate change issue. When people say: "global temperatures are rising" they usually mean they advocate certain state intervention, such as higher taxes on fuels. On the other side, most denialists advocate a free-market economy, less immigration, and a strong traditional national identity. None of these issues are related to the temperature of sea water, or the extent of ice-caps, or any other natural phenomena. If you look at what is in fact done with the climate change issue, you see it primarily used to promote 'green' products. So it is not a 'left-wing' or 'progressive' factor, except in the eyes of right-wing conspiracy theorists. Its most specific use is to promote the nuclear power industry, which is hardly a leftist plot. It is not used to reduce carbon emissions, because no government has a policy to do that. They say they do, at the Copenhagen conference for instance - but then western leaders also regularly say that they will give hundreds of billions to the poor in Africa. Easy, if you never have to pay. Absolute cynicism is the only way to treat the whole climate circus - the scientists, the politicians, the so-called environmental groups who seek nothing but finance for their own existence, the denialists. The right thing to do is to turn your back on all of them.
  - Nursie 10y ago
    Climate change is science. What we do about it is a scientific, engineering and political problem. Turning your back on multiple groups who are in no way equal - denialists and those with a wider environmental agenda are not the same as those giving us good science - is woeful and willful ignorance.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
varjag 10y ago
There is no such thing as "universally accepted evidence" on anything, and it's more about people than the evidence. There are still folks challenging relativist physics, theory of evolution or basic geography facts.

Nursie 10y ago

This is nonsense, years of scientific evidence and argument have overturned a lot of 'denialist' canards and made acceptance of the science much more widespread, including getting most western governments on board with it to various extents. Those with a religious zeal (in either direction) are a minority.

sevenless 10y ago
Climate change is an ideology. Terms like 'denialist' and 'warmist' indicate the ideological nature of the climate change issue. When people say: "global temperatures are rising" they usually mean they advocate certain state intervention, such as higher taxes on fuels. On the other side, most denialists advocate a free-market economy, less immigration, and a strong traditional national identity. None of these issues are related to the temperature of sea water, or the extent of ice-caps, or any other natural phenomena. If you look at what is in fact done with the climate change issue, you see it primarily used to promote 'green' products. So it is not a 'left-wing' or 'progressive' factor, except in the eyes of right-wing conspiracy theorists. Its most specific use is to promote the nuclear power industry, which is hardly a leftist plot. It is not used to reduce carbon emissions, because no government has a policy to do that. They say they do, at the Copenhagen conference for instance - but then western leaders also regularly say that they will give hundreds of billions to the poor in Africa. Easy, if you never have to pay. Absolute cynicism is the only way to treat the whole climate circus - the scientists, the politicians, the so-called environmental groups who seek nothing but finance for their own existence, the denialists. The right thing to do is to turn your back on all of them.
- Nursie 10y ago
  Climate change is science. What we do about it is a scientific, engineering and political problem. Turning your back on multiple groups who are in no way equal - denialists and those with a wider environmental agenda are not the same as those giving us good science - is woeful and willful ignorance.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]

varjag 10y ago

There is no such thing as "universally accepted evidence" on anything, and it's more about people than the evidence. There are still folks challenging relativist physics, theory of evolution or basic geography facts.