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If you spend 50% of your money through the military it is inevitable that much of your useful work will end up being funded that way. This in no way means we ne

If you spend 50% of your money through the military it is inevitable that much of your useful work will end up being funded that way. This in no way means we need to spend through the military; the same useful work could be funded regardless.

JoeAltmaier 10y ago
If. US is currently at 12%. Education, health care and pensions currently amount to > 60%. So its easy to cry wolf. We're really in a much better place than chicken little would have us all think.
- cm3 10y ago
  Assuming the percentage you cited is right, I do think the relative numbers are less important in my assertion than the absolute because with the current tools at hand it's hard to reduce that > 60% part. Only by finding better tools through more research can we, for example, reduce the need to spend that much on health care and pensions. If you consider the absolute amount spent on the battling part of the forces, I would like for battles, if they have to be fought, to shift into cyber space. Just getting rid of money spent on munitions alone would be huge. And more cyber wars means stronger need to build and use more secure IT infrastructure which will benefit everybody.
- astazangasta 10y ago
  In FY2017, $582.7 billion of $1.149 trillion in discretionary spending is on defense. Where do you get 12%?
  - NoGravitas 10y ago
    I imagine he is counting non-discretionary spending, like Medicare and Social Security, which are large, but are also separately funded.
- imaginenore 10y ago
  No, the US is currently at 54% military + 6% veteran benefits, while 6% education, 6% medicare + health, 3% science. https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/discretionary_spending_pie,_2015_enacted.png https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/discretionary_s...
  - JoeAltmaier 10y ago
    No, the :US total spending is just as I listed: http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/us_budget_pie_chart http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/us_budget_pie_chart Showing that abbreviated 'discretionary spending' subset of the budget is uninformative at best; dishonest at worst.
    - astazangasta 10y ago
      Uh, why? That's the portion of the budget that Congress actually has control over. Furthermore the mandatory portion (entitlements) are fundamentally different - you pay into the system through payroll taxes and pay out later during retirement. Vastly different from taking money from income taxes and using it to buy guns and planes.
      - dragonwriter 10y ago
        > That's the portion of the budget that Congress actually has control over. Congress has control over the whole budget. Unlike, e.g., the California Legislature and voter-mandated Constitutional spending in the state budget, there are no "mandates" in the "mandatory" part of the federal budget from some authority that transcends Congress, and it is well established that past acts of Congress do not bind future Congresses, or even future acts of the same Congress. > Furthermore the mandatory portion (entitlements) are fundamentally different - you pay into the system through payroll taxes and pay out later during retirement. That's not entirely true. While mandatory spending does include the payroll-tax-funded Social Security and Medicare programs, it also includes programs that are funded from general revenues like Medicaid, SNAP, EITC and the Child tax credit, etc.

JoeAltmaier 10y ago

If. US is currently at 12%. Education, health care and pensions currently amount to > 60%. So its easy to cry wolf. We're really in a much better place than chicken little would have us all think.

cm3 10y ago
Assuming the percentage you cited is right, I do think the relative numbers are less important in my assertion than the absolute because with the current tools at hand it's hard to reduce that > 60% part. Only by finding better tools through more research can we, for example, reduce the need to spend that much on health care and pensions. If you consider the absolute amount spent on the battling part of the forces, I would like for battles, if they have to be fought, to shift into cyber space. Just getting rid of money spent on munitions alone would be huge. And more cyber wars means stronger need to build and use more secure IT infrastructure which will benefit everybody.
astazangasta 10y ago
In FY2017, $582.7 billion of $1.149 trillion in discretionary spending is on defense. Where do you get 12%?
- NoGravitas 10y ago
  I imagine he is counting non-discretionary spending, like Medicare and Social Security, which are large, but are also separately funded.
imaginenore 10y ago
No, the US is currently at 54% military + 6% veteran benefits, while 6% education, 6% medicare + health, 3% science. https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/discretionary_spending_pie,_2015_enacted.png https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/discretionary_s...
- JoeAltmaier 10y ago
  No, the :US total spending is just as I listed: http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/us_budget_pie_chart http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/us_budget_pie_chart Showing that abbreviated 'discretionary spending' subset of the budget is uninformative at best; dishonest at worst.
  - astazangasta 10y ago
    Uh, why? That's the portion of the budget that Congress actually has control over. Furthermore the mandatory portion (entitlements) are fundamentally different - you pay into the system through payroll taxes and pay out later during retirement. Vastly different from taking money from income taxes and using it to buy guns and planes.
    - dragonwriter 10y ago
      > That's the portion of the budget that Congress actually has control over. Congress has control over the whole budget. Unlike, e.g., the California Legislature and voter-mandated Constitutional spending in the state budget, there are no "mandates" in the "mandatory" part of the federal budget from some authority that transcends Congress, and it is well established that past acts of Congress do not bind future Congresses, or even future acts of the same Congress. > Furthermore the mandatory portion (entitlements) are fundamentally different - you pay into the system through payroll taxes and pay out later during retirement. That's not entirely true. While mandatory spending does include the payroll-tax-funded Social Security and Medicare programs, it also includes programs that are funded from general revenues like Medicaid, SNAP, EITC and the Child tax credit, etc.