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> almost nothing is manufactured anymore in the West It's a myth. See this for example: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-manufacturing-dead-output-has-doubl

by lgieron 10y ago

> almost nothing is manufactured anymore in the West It's a myth. See this for example: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-manufacturing-dead-output-has-doubled-in-three-decades-2016-03-28 http://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-manufacturing-dead-outpu...

DominikR 10y ago
You know, I can't really believe that these statistics resemble reality when we all know that the US has an enormous trade deficit for such a long time, yet there's nothing to show for it in terms of income or living standards. Living standards have not improved for decades and there's lots of research showing that it actually has slightly declined. Somewhere this profit must end up, it can't just vanish? What I believe is they count stuff like manufacturing of iPhones in China where the profits never arrive in the US. Also a comment below the article points something out that I'm going to quote: "The gross value of production in 1986 (T50030) is $2,214,450,700,000. Today, it's $3,641,055,400,000. So it hasn't doubled or tripled at all. In fact, that's only 75% of what we were producing in 1986, because when you adjust the 1986 figure for inflation, we would have to be at $4,870,130,000,000 JUST TO BE EVEN! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out. In 1986 we imported $986,522,790,000 (adjusted for inflation) in goods. This year, we are on track to have $2,892,000,000,000 in imports. That extra $2T in imported goods are goods we used to make here in the US. So in an economy with a total output of $16.8 trillion, we've handed $2T of our industrial production off to other countries. That's $2T in manufacturing output, or 38 million jobs with a starting pay of $33k. " His numbers are correct: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GVIPT50030S https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GVIPT50030S And then the article states something that I find very concerning: "The crude oil may come from Canada, Saudi Arabia or North Dakota, but it’s refined right here in America. Refined petroleum products — such as gasoline, fuel oil, jet fuel and liquefied refinery gases — are America’s top manufactured product, with a value of shipments going out the factory door of nearly $700 billion in 2014, more than four times as much as the No. 2 product: light trucks." If that is true, then the US is in even greater troubles than I had thought, because it doesn't seem to be an industry that is so hard to copy that Saudi Arabia couldn't do it themselves if needed.

by lgieron 10y ago

DominikR 10y ago

You know, I can't really believe that these statistics resemble reality when we all know that the US has an enormous trade deficit for such a long time, yet there's nothing to show for it in terms of income or living standards. Living standards have not improved for decades and there's lots of research showing that it actually has slightly declined. Somewhere this profit must end up, it can't just vanish? What I believe is they count stuff like manufacturing of iPhones in China where the profits never arrive in the US. Also a comment below the article points something out that I'm going to quote: "The gross value of production in 1986 (T50030) is $2,214,450,700,000. Today, it's $3,641,055,400,000. So it hasn't doubled or tripled at all. In fact, that's only 75% of what we were producing in 1986, because when you adjust the 1986 figure for inflation, we would have to be at $4,870,130,000,000 JUST TO BE EVEN! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out. In 1986 we imported $986,522,790,000 (adjusted for inflation) in goods. This year, we are on track to have $2,892,000,000,000 in imports. That extra $2T in imported goods are goods we used to make here in the US. So in an economy with a total output of $16.8 trillion, we've handed $2T of our industrial production off to other countries. That's $2T in manufacturing output, or 38 million jobs with a starting pay of $33k. " His numbers are correct: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GVIPT50030S https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GVIPT50030S And then the article states something that I find very concerning: "The crude oil may come from Canada, Saudi Arabia or North Dakota, but it’s refined right here in America. Refined petroleum products — such as gasoline, fuel oil, jet fuel and liquefied refinery gases — are America’s top manufactured product, with a value of shipments going out the factory door of nearly $700 billion in 2014, more than four times as much as the No. 2 product: light trucks." If that is true, then the US is in even greater troubles than I had thought, because it doesn't seem to be an industry that is so hard to copy that Saudi Arabia couldn't do it themselves if needed.