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I understand that a surprising number of people don't appear to be qualified. Though in the majority of cases succeeding in a job doesn't have to do with qualif

I understand that a surprising number of people don't appear to be qualified. Though in the majority of cases succeeding in a job doesn't have to do with qualifications rather it boils down to determination. See any Paul graham commentary if you don't believe me (though I have considerable experience managing from high school to doctorate level). I suggest we stop kidding ourselves on how hard most jobs are. Most jobs aren't hard and can be trained with a surprisingly low amount of effort. Though most people instead choose to spend that effort sifting through candidates holding out for the 10x engineer. I think we'd be better off seeking out determined individuals and getting on with the actual work.

droopyEyelids 10y ago
I think you’re settling an unreasonable standard for discussion by mentioning the 10x engineer as hiring target. It’s often difficult to find someone that doesn’t outright lie on their resume. It’s hard to find someone that will be able to contribute to your team rather than make a negative impact. I try and hire engineers and we have to go through dozens of candidates to find someone who just seems motivated and competent
- _asummers 10y ago
  > I try and hire engineers and we have to go through dozens of candidates to find someone who just seems motivated and competent This has been our experience as well.
- ryandrake 10y ago
  > I try and hire engineers and we have to go through dozens of candidates to find someone who just seems motivated and competent This statement is dependent on one's definition of motivated and competent. Additionally, I think in general a company gets the candidate stream that its job description/offered salary deserves. Pay peanuts, expect a line of monkeys applying.
  - GrumpyYoungMan 10y ago
    >Pay peanuts, expect a line of monkeys applying. While that might be true, if you pay six figures, all you get is an even bigger line of monkeys applying.
throwwit 10y ago
If a company thinks it can hold off hiring through 10 interview rounds for a 10x, it will have the same ROI and the added benefit of statistics to prompt government action/assistance. Unfortunately, in turn, catering to increase the supply of workers causes a longer tail of unemployment so a certain socioeconomic tragedy of the commons ensues. Seems like a runaway effect. Not to mention the compounding effects of the work experience catch-22 as for any job, AND a hidden requisite of unofficial apprenticeship experience.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- throwwit 10y ago
  Just to make sure I don't confound the term ROI, I'm referring to hiring costs. Long term employee costs of 1/10x # of desks also incentivize the pattern.
aidenn0 10y ago
If someone has been in the industry for 4 years and still can't do basic tasks in their language of choice, I think we can decide they either lack the talent or the determination.

droopyEyelids 10y ago

I think you’re settling an unreasonable standard for discussion by mentioning the 10x engineer as hiring target. It’s often difficult to find someone that doesn’t outright lie on their resume. It’s hard to find someone that will be able to contribute to your team rather than make a negative impact. I try and hire engineers and we have to go through dozens of candidates to find someone who just seems motivated and competent

_asummers 10y ago
> I try and hire engineers and we have to go through dozens of candidates to find someone who just seems motivated and competent This has been our experience as well.
ryandrake 10y ago
> I try and hire engineers and we have to go through dozens of candidates to find someone who just seems motivated and competent This statement is dependent on one's definition of motivated and competent. Additionally, I think in general a company gets the candidate stream that its job description/offered salary deserves. Pay peanuts, expect a line of monkeys applying.
- GrumpyYoungMan 10y ago
  >Pay peanuts, expect a line of monkeys applying. While that might be true, if you pay six figures, all you get is an even bigger line of monkeys applying.

throwwit 10y ago

If a company thinks it can hold off hiring through 10 interview rounds for a 10x, it will have the same ROI and the added benefit of statistics to prompt government action/assistance. Unfortunately, in turn, catering to increase the supply of workers causes a longer tail of unemployment so a certain socioeconomic tragedy of the commons ensues. Seems like a runaway effect. Not to mention the compounding effects of the work experience catch-22 as for any job, AND a hidden requisite of unofficial apprenticeship experience.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
throwwit 10y ago
Just to make sure I don't confound the term ROI, I'm referring to hiring costs. Long term employee costs of 1/10x # of desks also incentivize the pattern.

aidenn0 10y ago

If someone has been in the industry for 4 years and still can't do basic tasks in their language of choice, I think we can decide they either lack the talent or the determination.