5 ms·

Mapping the World of Music Using Machine Learning: Part 1

108 points by ravimody 10y ago

3dfan 10y ago
Reminds me of http://www.music-map.com http://www.music-map.com which is pretty useful to discover new music.
- ravimody 10y ago
  Agreed, music map is a great interactive way to discover music. Last year one of our internal hack week teams built something like that using our vector space model. What was cool is you could switch between the different types from the UI, e.g. Nirvana -> Red Hot Chili Peppers -> DC101 Alternative Rock. You could also start stations from the UI - it was really fun discovering music with it!
- epalmer 10y ago
  Thanks - this is just what I need. I listen to old rock and roll, new age jazz, texas swing, country gospel and so much more... I tried Santana, Mountain, Ten Years After, Alison Krauss and Union Station, Asleep at the Wheel I see bands I like and some new ones to try. I'm going to use this to create some new google play playlists for my commute. Thank you so much. [EDIT] typo
- placebo 10y ago
  I created something similar a couple of years ago: http://www.nocurve.com/musicmap/ http://www.nocurve.com/musicmap/ If anyone is interested in how it was implemented: http://nocurve.com/fun-with-data/data-mining-on-freedb/ http://nocurve.com/fun-with-data/data-mining-on-freedb/
- rhizome 10y ago
  It works best on more mainstream and established acts. It falls apart on artists with fewer sales/visibility.
guelo 10y ago
I must be weird because I like music across a wide range of styles, electronica, rock, rap, r&b, pop, world, and all mixtures of them. I get bored being stuck in an algorithmic bubble with similar sounding music for too long. I like music that is "interesting, according to me" but I can't really define interesting until I listen to it.
- 6stringmerc 10y ago
  You're not weird, and this modelling experiment's unsavory undercurrent is that it's trying to figure out how to keep you on iHeart Radio / Clear Channel stations...and nowhere else...for all your music listening needs. Basically, if it isn't on their system, you won't know it exists. Walled garden to the extreme.
- ravimody 10y ago
  I'm similar - I have an eclectic taste in music that is often not served well by static, long-term algorithms that place me into a "well" of the same sounding music. It's a problem I think about a lot. Matrix factorization can deal with this a bit by using the high dimensional space to place your tastes into an area that reflects many different styles at the same time. In part 2 of the blog post we're going to talk about how we're modeling the acoustic qualities of music, which can find common patterns from completely different genres (for example, you may like soothing music with female vocals in both jazz and indie rock). In part 3 we'll talk a bit about how we can combine recent signals (like thumbs) to take into account your current mood, which I find helps pinpoint interesting music to surface right now.
  - omegaworks 10y ago
    >how we can combine recent signals (like thumbs) to take into account your current mood This is the most interesting part of the problem to me. I always worry that the signals I send my favorite music radio service permanently alter the course of the channel. In some cases, I want that. In others I don't.
  - chestervonwinch 10y ago
    > we're going to talk about how we're modeling the acoustic qualities of music, which can find common patterns from completely different genres That's neat! I was curious of this is / was being looked into. It seems like I often get music that's matched based on a demographic (if that makes sense), rather than music matched on the characteristic features of the current song / band.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
6stringmerc 10y ago
iHeart Radio? The child of Clear Channel? The conglomerate that bought up all sorts of regional stations and homogenized them to the point of seemingly choking regional sounds and styles in the favor of slick, corporate approved campaigns to consolidate listeners into pens like cattle to the slaughter[1]? My take, as a musician, is that this isn't about helping listeners find "Music they love" - if it does happen, a lucky accident for the listener. It's fundamentally trying to exploit algorithms and human nature to be able to charge more for ad space. The business hates risk, and this modelling and "learning" is simply to reduce their risk of playing a track that might encourage a person to, you know, change the station. This may sound extremely cynical, but it's hard to deny that Clear Channel is a very spurious company playing the same old "We love music and musicians" card when they're really talking about their own profits. [1] Just one article - it's been covered time and again. http://www.daveyd.com/articlesclearchannelbyjeffpearlstein.html http://www.daveyd.com/articlesclearchannelbyjeffpearlstein.h...
- kafkaesq 10y ago
  Agreed. They seem to have some pretty smart people behind the curtain, and I imagine the work is probably quite interesting on an abstract, technical level. But I've always found iHeartRadio to be one of the most obnoxious listening experiences imaginable every time I've been a captive audience of it.
- jamminontheone 10y ago
  From what I remember Clear Channel purchased a company called Thumbplay and rolled it into iHeart Radio to build out their web app. The developers that they acquired with that purchase whom I've met legitimately are music fans and had very mixed feelings about having to work for Clear Channel. Just an anecdote, I totally agree with your sentiment.
  - 6stringmerc 10y ago
    Oh I can understand! I'd feel for their plight too; it took me a while to get out from a couple gigs that I had principles in conflict with, so "doing it for the paycheck" isn't a light subject. Thanks for sharing, especially as a reminder that where we start and why we start may not be where we end up in the long-run.
Dramatize 10y ago
Spotify's Discover Weekly playlist is doing a great job creating a mixtape of new music. It's the best example of 'you might also like' I've seen.
- 6stringmerc 10y ago
  Glad to hear you like it, because I think in some foreign countries (according to my accounting) their system is introducing my material at a respectable rate. They aren't getting 'pushed' like based on an ad campaign, spike-and-valley style. It's much more that one or two listens might happen - granted, this could be from other 'touch points' but going back in time before I was as coordinated account wise. Can't claim it as fact, but gut instinct I suppose.

108 points by ravimody 10y ago

3dfan 10y ago

Reminds me of http://www.music-map.com http://www.music-map.com which is pretty useful to discover new music.

ravimody 10y ago
Agreed, music map is a great interactive way to discover music. Last year one of our internal hack week teams built something like that using our vector space model. What was cool is you could switch between the different types from the UI, e.g. Nirvana -> Red Hot Chili Peppers -> DC101 Alternative Rock. You could also start stations from the UI - it was really fun discovering music with it!
epalmer 10y ago
Thanks - this is just what I need. I listen to old rock and roll, new age jazz, texas swing, country gospel and so much more... I tried Santana, Mountain, Ten Years After, Alison Krauss and Union Station, Asleep at the Wheel I see bands I like and some new ones to try. I'm going to use this to create some new google play playlists for my commute. Thank you so much. [EDIT] typo
placebo 10y ago
I created something similar a couple of years ago: http://www.nocurve.com/musicmap/ http://www.nocurve.com/musicmap/ If anyone is interested in how it was implemented: http://nocurve.com/fun-with-data/data-mining-on-freedb/ http://nocurve.com/fun-with-data/data-mining-on-freedb/
rhizome 10y ago
It works best on more mainstream and established acts. It falls apart on artists with fewer sales/visibility.

guelo 10y ago

I must be weird because I like music across a wide range of styles, electronica, rock, rap, r&b, pop, world, and all mixtures of them. I get bored being stuck in an algorithmic bubble with similar sounding music for too long. I like music that is "interesting, according to me" but I can't really define interesting until I listen to it.

6stringmerc 10y ago
You're not weird, and this modelling experiment's unsavory undercurrent is that it's trying to figure out how to keep you on iHeart Radio / Clear Channel stations...and nowhere else...for all your music listening needs. Basically, if it isn't on their system, you won't know it exists. Walled garden to the extreme.
ravimody 10y ago
I'm similar - I have an eclectic taste in music that is often not served well by static, long-term algorithms that place me into a "well" of the same sounding music. It's a problem I think about a lot. Matrix factorization can deal with this a bit by using the high dimensional space to place your tastes into an area that reflects many different styles at the same time. In part 2 of the blog post we're going to talk about how we're modeling the acoustic qualities of music, which can find common patterns from completely different genres (for example, you may like soothing music with female vocals in both jazz and indie rock). In part 3 we'll talk a bit about how we can combine recent signals (like thumbs) to take into account your current mood, which I find helps pinpoint interesting music to surface right now.
- omegaworks 10y ago
  >how we can combine recent signals (like thumbs) to take into account your current mood This is the most interesting part of the problem to me. I always worry that the signals I send my favorite music radio service permanently alter the course of the channel. In some cases, I want that. In others I don't.
- chestervonwinch 10y ago
  > we're going to talk about how we're modeling the acoustic qualities of music, which can find common patterns from completely different genres That's neat! I was curious of this is / was being looked into. It seems like I often get music that's matched based on a demographic (if that makes sense), rather than music matched on the characteristic features of the current song / band.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

6stringmerc 10y ago

iHeart Radio? The child of Clear Channel? The conglomerate that bought up all sorts of regional stations and homogenized them to the point of seemingly choking regional sounds and styles in the favor of slick, corporate approved campaigns to consolidate listeners into pens like cattle to the slaughter[1]? My take, as a musician, is that this isn't about helping listeners find "Music they love" - if it does happen, a lucky accident for the listener. It's fundamentally trying to exploit algorithms and human nature to be able to charge more for ad space. The business hates risk, and this modelling and "learning" is simply to reduce their risk of playing a track that might encourage a person to, you know, change the station. This may sound extremely cynical, but it's hard to deny that Clear Channel is a very spurious company playing the same old "We love music and musicians" card when they're really talking about their own profits. [1] Just one article - it's been covered time and again. http://www.daveyd.com/articlesclearchannelbyjeffpearlstein.html http://www.daveyd.com/articlesclearchannelbyjeffpearlstein.h...

kafkaesq 10y ago
Agreed. They seem to have some pretty smart people behind the curtain, and I imagine the work is probably quite interesting on an abstract, technical level. But I've always found iHeartRadio to be one of the most obnoxious listening experiences imaginable every time I've been a captive audience of it.
jamminontheone 10y ago
From what I remember Clear Channel purchased a company called Thumbplay and rolled it into iHeart Radio to build out their web app. The developers that they acquired with that purchase whom I've met legitimately are music fans and had very mixed feelings about having to work for Clear Channel. Just an anecdote, I totally agree with your sentiment.
- 6stringmerc 10y ago
  Oh I can understand! I'd feel for their plight too; it took me a while to get out from a couple gigs that I had principles in conflict with, so "doing it for the paycheck" isn't a light subject. Thanks for sharing, especially as a reminder that where we start and why we start may not be where we end up in the long-run.

Dramatize 10y ago

Spotify's Discover Weekly playlist is doing a great job creating a mixtape of new music. It's the best example of 'you might also like' I've seen.

6stringmerc 10y ago
Glad to hear you like it, because I think in some foreign countries (according to my accounting) their system is introducing my material at a respectable rate. They aren't getting 'pushed' like based on an ad campaign, spike-and-valley style. It's much more that one or two listens might happen - granted, this could be from other 'touch points' but going back in time before I was as coordinated account wise. Can't claim it as fact, but gut instinct I suppose.