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I worked my way through college. If my kids try to do the same it will take them more than 14 years if they match my work. The snow you walked uphill both ways

I worked my way through college. If my kids try to do the same it will take them more than 14 years if they match my work. The snow you walked uphill both ways in wasn't as deep as you think.

enraged_camel 10y ago
Yeah. I think it's a huge issue when people romanticize the hard work they have done in the past and expect the same from their children. It's one thing to say "my kid should be financially literate" and another thing to say "I sweeped floors at a supermarket when I was a teenager and so should my kid." IMO our goal should be to make life better for our children, and that involves giving them opportunities and resources so that they don't have to work as hard as us, unless they absolutely have to. My dad worked through college, but paid for my college so that I could focus on my studies. I plan to do even more for my own kids in the future, maybe by paying for their grad schools as well.
- rtpg 10y ago
  I think what GP was trying to mention is that the cost of things like college have gone up immensely since then. The same strategies won't work now. You can't live on a minimum wage job in most places in the US, let alone live + pay for school
- eggy 10y ago
  You misread me. I don't expect my son or other children to work sweeping floors or otherwise. Each generation of my family has improved life for the next generation. From my Momo, grandma, coming over as a cleaning lady for New Yorkers, to my Dad driving a truck or other such job. I worked through college, but dropped out voluntarily. I think there are other opportunities to learn nowadays aside from university and graduate school unless you want to be a doctor, engineer, or lawyer. My son and daughter volunteer and work and go to school. They are both doing exceptional. My son was number one in the entire county in Chemistry this past year. I am split on whether they would be better off not working or volunteering at all. It is their choice; I didn't ask it of them. I did offer them the option of focusing solely on studies, but they like what they do. What can I say? I have friends whose kids are given whatever they please. These are not friends who grew up where or how I did. Their kids are having all sorts of serious adaptation issues. I think it is due to having too much time and no responsibility. I work hard at my art and job, no romanticizing here. The drunk writer, or coder who just wings it, are stereotypes. The real achievers work their ass off. I know from being a manager of hundreds, and including myself, that busy people seem to get more work done. I am not talking about the culture of no sleep, 75 hours per week. I am talking about having 30 hours of real work per week in a 40 hour week, and not 10 hours and making up for the deficit in a 75 hour week, which seems common in some companies.
eggy 10y ago
I did too, but I left university, and did pretty good for myself despite that decision. University is a choice unless you need the paper to be a doctor, engineer or lawyer, or other 'professional'. I personally do not subscribe to the public education system. I am home schooling my youngest here in East Java. My eldest sone is studying German, and thinking on going to Germany for university, which is very cheap even for foreigners. My daughter goes to an affordable college. The days of elite universities and Ivy league tuition are numbered. I had the joy of somebody I met traveling telling me how much debt he had to send his son to Cornell. I simply said why not a more affordable school, to which he replied, "Because you know your kid is set for life with that piece of paper no matter how he performs as long as he graduates." I am almost gagged. It's elitist attitudes like that I disdain, and frankly, I don't think the programs vary in proportion to the cash outlay and debt for life. I like the 'if you landed on a deserted island who would you want with you', and by that metric, I am very confident in my son, not so much in the elitist's son. I am not sure how to take your 'snow' comment, since that comes from a comedy routine, and yes, I understand its take on hyperbole. But I can pretty much guess you cannot speak to how deep or inclined the snow was for me ;)
- wmil 10y ago
  The problem is that the ivy league elitists control access to most of the best jobs. Resumes from the affordable school your daughter is attending are quickly filed in the round bin. The quality of education doesn't actually vary much, but the quality of the contacts and the doors opened is greatly improved by more prestigious schools. The US job market is just much more competitive now than when you were young. Look at the numbers. There are about 4.5 million 22 year olds in the US. There are over 1 million new legal immigrants each year. Basically entry level jobs are flooded. And jumping career tracks is far more difficult than you think, HR departments aren't huge believers in IQ or transferable skills. A bad school can lead to a bad job track, and that can lead to a life long struggle.
  - eggy 10y ago
    I have jumped outside that track, and it is what I am teaching my kids to think about. What best jobs? What does it mean to be successful? I have far less money than some of my peers, but they envy my lifestyle of living minimally and in different countries. It all depends on what your goals are, and what group you run with I guess. I say question your assumptions. As far as being more competitive, I don't buy it. 1 million, 1 billion, if you truly have common sense and some intellect, you beat out 99% of those numbers, and the common sense doesn't seemed to have scaled to make the population that now enters the market any more difficult, but that is purely limited empirical obsevation on my part. BTW, I am still in the job market, so I am familiar with how competitive it is, and I don't rely on just established connections. I venture out of my comfort zone often. From programming, to diving to maintain and fix electrical and hydralic systems underwater, to managing installations and subsequent operations of a few world-class installations of unique equipment, and an odd assortment of other skills. And, I did it without completing a degree. See that was my attempt at putting me CV out there ;)

I worked my way through college. If my kids try to do the same it will take them more than 14 years if they match my work. The snow you walked uphill both ways in wasn't as deep as you think.

enraged_camel 10y ago

Yeah. I think it's a huge issue when people romanticize the hard work they have done in the past and expect the same from their children. It's one thing to say "my kid should be financially literate" and another thing to say "I sweeped floors at a supermarket when I was a teenager and so should my kid." IMO our goal should be to make life better for our children, and that involves giving them opportunities and resources so that they don't have to work as hard as us, unless they absolutely have to. My dad worked through college, but paid for my college so that I could focus on my studies. I plan to do even more for my own kids in the future, maybe by paying for their grad schools as well.

rtpg 10y ago
I think what GP was trying to mention is that the cost of things like college have gone up immensely since then. The same strategies won't work now. You can't live on a minimum wage job in most places in the US, let alone live + pay for school
eggy 10y ago
You misread me. I don't expect my son or other children to work sweeping floors or otherwise. Each generation of my family has improved life for the next generation. From my Momo, grandma, coming over as a cleaning lady for New Yorkers, to my Dad driving a truck or other such job. I worked through college, but dropped out voluntarily. I think there are other opportunities to learn nowadays aside from university and graduate school unless you want to be a doctor, engineer, or lawyer. My son and daughter volunteer and work and go to school. They are both doing exceptional. My son was number one in the entire county in Chemistry this past year. I am split on whether they would be better off not working or volunteering at all. It is their choice; I didn't ask it of them. I did offer them the option of focusing solely on studies, but they like what they do. What can I say? I have friends whose kids are given whatever they please. These are not friends who grew up where or how I did. Their kids are having all sorts of serious adaptation issues. I think it is due to having too much time and no responsibility. I work hard at my art and job, no romanticizing here. The drunk writer, or coder who just wings it, are stereotypes. The real achievers work their ass off. I know from being a manager of hundreds, and including myself, that busy people seem to get more work done. I am not talking about the culture of no sleep, 75 hours per week. I am talking about having 30 hours of real work per week in a 40 hour week, and not 10 hours and making up for the deficit in a 75 hour week, which seems common in some companies.

eggy 10y ago

I did too, but I left university, and did pretty good for myself despite that decision. University is a choice unless you need the paper to be a doctor, engineer or lawyer, or other 'professional'. I personally do not subscribe to the public education system. I am home schooling my youngest here in East Java. My eldest sone is studying German, and thinking on going to Germany for university, which is very cheap even for foreigners. My daughter goes to an affordable college. The days of elite universities and Ivy league tuition are numbered. I had the joy of somebody I met traveling telling me how much debt he had to send his son to Cornell. I simply said why not a more affordable school, to which he replied, "Because you know your kid is set for life with that piece of paper no matter how he performs as long as he graduates." I am almost gagged. It's elitist attitudes like that I disdain, and frankly, I don't think the programs vary in proportion to the cash outlay and debt for life. I like the 'if you landed on a deserted island who would you want with you', and by that metric, I am very confident in my son, not so much in the elitist's son. I am not sure how to take your 'snow' comment, since that comes from a comedy routine, and yes, I understand its take on hyperbole. But I can pretty much guess you cannot speak to how deep or inclined the snow was for me ;)

wmil 10y ago
The problem is that the ivy league elitists control access to most of the best jobs. Resumes from the affordable school your daughter is attending are quickly filed in the round bin. The quality of education doesn't actually vary much, but the quality of the contacts and the doors opened is greatly improved by more prestigious schools. The US job market is just much more competitive now than when you were young. Look at the numbers. There are about 4.5 million 22 year olds in the US. There are over 1 million new legal immigrants each year. Basically entry level jobs are flooded. And jumping career tracks is far more difficult than you think, HR departments aren't huge believers in IQ or transferable skills. A bad school can lead to a bad job track, and that can lead to a life long struggle.
- eggy 10y ago
  I have jumped outside that track, and it is what I am teaching my kids to think about. What best jobs? What does it mean to be successful? I have far less money than some of my peers, but they envy my lifestyle of living minimally and in different countries. It all depends on what your goals are, and what group you run with I guess. I say question your assumptions. As far as being more competitive, I don't buy it. 1 million, 1 billion, if you truly have common sense and some intellect, you beat out 99% of those numbers, and the common sense doesn't seemed to have scaled to make the population that now enters the market any more difficult, but that is purely limited empirical obsevation on my part. BTW, I am still in the job market, so I am familiar with how competitive it is, and I don't rely on just established connections. I venture out of my comfort zone often. From programming, to diving to maintain and fix electrical and hydralic systems underwater, to managing installations and subsequent operations of a few world-class installations of unique equipment, and an odd assortment of other skills. And, I did it without completing a degree. See that was my attempt at putting me CV out there ;)