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True, but as far as I know most incidents of the USSR coming close to a nuclear strike were accidents or technical glitches. IMO it's incredibly unlikely the US
by pluma 10y ago
True, but as far as I know most incidents of the USSR coming close to a nuclear strike were accidents or technical glitches. IMO it's incredibly unlikely the USSR would have had actually used nuclear weapons precisely because the military had such an aversion to actually using it.
OTOH incidents like Able Archer demonstrate exactly the kind of carelessness I'm talking about: that anyone was surprised the USSR could have mistaken a realistic, unannounced, off-schedule "simulation" near their borders for the real thing is idiotic. This kind of posturing is extremely dangerous and the US is still doing it today.
Sure, Russia and other "bad actors" are doing similar things, but the US is often going further (except for maybe the recent antics by North Korea -- which everybody expects to do ridiculously crazy things to begin with because they're a hereditary dictatorship, not a democratic republic).
That said, nuclear weapons are not a deterrent. Unless you're a sociopathic caveman, condemning all of humanity to death just because your nation state's integrity is at risk is an unimaginable atrocity. It's the ultimate war crime. Threatening the use of nuclear weapons is holding all of mankind (alive and future) hostage -- it's frankly disgusting.
Not that anyone would be able to or interested in actually having a meaningful war with the US. We're well past the age of rolling into other people's countries with tanks and planting down a flag. A war between Russia and the US would ruin both countries' economies and neither party would come out on top -- even if the US didn't have a massive army (or Russia didn't have a massive territory).
My biggest gripe wrt US vs Russia is actually that Russia and China both have an official No-First-Use policy but the US explicitly reserves the right to a nuclear first strike (not even paying lip service as a sign of good will -- because let's face it: if Russia or China violates their NFU policy against the US it's irrelevant anyway). And while Russia has been a strong proponent of nuclear disarmament since the final years of the USSR, the US has been quite the opposite.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_first_use https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_first_use
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_disarmament https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_disarmament
- wil421 10y agoThe instance with the USSR sub wasnt a glitch. How is a training exercise the US's fault? This was a NATO operation in Europe. At the time we werent speaking to Russia very much. Military exercises happen all the time between many countries. Lets not forget that Russia had just shot down a civilian airliner that had a US congressman on board.[1] Could you imagine if the US brought down a plane with Russian politicians on it during the cold war. When has the US ever brought down a civilian airliner? Russia just did this again last year over Ukraine.[2] >That said, nuclear weapons are not a deterrent. Unless you're a sociopathic caveman, condemning all of humanity to death just because your nation state's integrity is at risk is an unimaginable atrocity. It's the ultimate war crime. Threatening the use of nuclear weapons is holding all of mankind (alive and future) hostage -- it's frankly disgusting. I understand your sentiment but North Korea and Iran are currently trying to develop Nukes for this sole purpose. Your pointing all your fingers at the US but the fact is everyone else is either doing it or trying to do it. Not to mention Russia is annexing sovereign nations.[3][4] I am not saying this meaning we should start a war with Russia but when the US "invades" somewhere we do not annex the country. The Iraq war was a huge mistake but maybe if we stayed a little longer ISIS its possible would never have happened. Unfortunately politics came into play way after the mistake. In no way am I trying to make excuses. Here are some fresh examples of Chinese and Russian/Chinese military exercises in a disputed area.[5] Another example from 2 days ago where they are shooting missiles. [6] Everyone wants to point fingers at the US when their own governments are either actively doing the same things, or making deals with the US to do the same thing. Spying on communications has been going on since WW2 and even before. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_007 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_007 [2]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_17 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_17 [3]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_intervention_in_Ukraine_(2014%E2%80%93present) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_intervention_... [4]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War#Aftermath https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War#Aftermath [5]http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/2016/07/28/south-china-sea-russia-military-exercise/87651530/ http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/2016/07/28/south... [6]http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/08/02/asia-pacific/chinese-navy-holds-live-fire-drills-in-east-china-sea/ http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/08/02/asia-pacific/chi...
- mabo 10y ago> When has the US ever brought down a civilian airliner? It has happened: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655
- wil421 10y agoVery interesting I've never heard of this incident. Thanks for the link.
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