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Why cut these services?! Is Florida going to add more police, social workers, ER doctors and etc deal with the consequences?
by leekh 10y ago
Why cut these services?!
Is Florida going to add more police, social workers, ER doctors and etc deal with the consequences?
- trhway 10y ago>Is Florida going to add more police, social workers, ER doctors and etc deal with the consequences? no. Like all the others it will add more prisons. Prison guards unions and commercial prison providers are doing exceptionally well financially and the prison guard unions are actually the biggest and most powerful lobbyists, at least in CA. There is no such thing as decrease of spending, there are only increase and redistribution - benefiting the most powerful of course.
- honkhonkpants 10y agoI've never heard of the correctional officers' union (CCPOA) being a top lobbyist. I don't see it anywhere on this list, which puts it out of the top 100. http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article57960523.html http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert... Edit: I can't find any primary sources regarding lobbying by the CCPOA, but I did find a blog on a site called Union Watch that makes the claim about CCPOA being the largest lobbyist, and then I saw that quotes in Reason, and the a lot of people quoting Reason. So, right-wing echo chamber in action as far as I can tell.
- trhway 10y agoi meant "lobbyist" in the more wide sense than the pure officially reported total sum of receipts of breakfasts with senators. I meant it in the sense of demonstrated ability to steer decisions to their own benefit. And when it come to right/left wing - while both are unions, teachers union and prison guard union are on the opposite sides, so pigeon-hole accordingly.
- honkhonkpants 10y agoSo you believe that adding up all election and/or legislation-influencing activities would reveal that CCPOA is the largest actor in California politics, despite the fact that even in above-board registered lobbying the oil industry spent $22 million last year? I think your claim requires some substantiation.
- trhway 10y ago>CCPOA is the largest actor in California politics it isn't exactly full order, so you kind of right in questioning my statements at their absolute face value. It is more like partial order here - oil industry and the guards have orthogonal interests. Except for the one aspect - guards consume state budget while oil industry is a source of it. And as we know from the business community whining - CA is considered "not business friendly"/"high tax state". Though of course i don't think the guards and oil clash directly here - the guards' politics is more about redistribution of the budget away from the other categories. I.e the oil and the guards have their own big fields to play, and when it comes to their own fields, the guards have much higher success than oil in their respective fields in CA. And, man, $22 millions is just a rounding error for either of the players - the CA prison budget is $10B. If you remember the beginning of Schwarzenegger's time, the first thing he did was taking on the biggest problem of the state - the guards union. He failed. No surprise here given the nature of the task. Still my personal great respect to him - he was the only one who even have ever tried to do it.
- honkhonkpants 10y agoThat's a bizarre interpretation of events. Schwarzenegger went along with the prison industry by vigorously opposing Prop. 66 (reforming the three strikes rule) and generally taking a "tough on crime" stance. Prison population increased every year under his administration until a court (and eventually the US Supreme Court) finally ordered the state to reduce it. Schwarzenegger's solution to overcrowding was to ship inmates to other states, which is shock doctrine privatization, not union busting. Brown has actually reduced the prison population, notably by reforming sentencing laws and reclassifying many crimes as misdemeanors. The California prison population now stands at a level lower than in 1996, and a per-capita level lower than in 1992.
- rbanffy 10y agoIt's one route to privatization. Cut funding, manage poorly until nobody believes the state can do the job, then sell to your allies.
- mrits 10y agoIt's one route to nationalization. Increase regulation, make impossible to manage until nobody believes the company can do the job, then add it to your political platform.
- connoredel 10y agoDon't know why you're being downvoted. You astutely point out that just as defunding can cause a move toward privatization (or the belief that only private enterprise can solve a given problem), so too can overregulation lead toward nationalization (or even at state/local levels, the belief that only government can solve it).
- eagsalazar2 10y agoBecause some people feel that businesses being strangled by regulation is a favorite straw man those in favor of deregulation trot out to protect their interests. The original scenario, at least in the opinions of some people, is a nice summary of the abuses of privatization while the down voted scenario is a right wing bogeyman meant to scare the ignorant into voting against their own interests. (In some people's opinion)
- pessimizer 10y agoI won't downvote it if anyone can show an example of it actually ever happening.
- hobs 10y agoSo cutting funding is increasing regulation how?
- kbenson 10y ago
- pbarnes_1 10y agoWho do you think cut these services? This is GOP 101. Never elect a Republican governor. See MI, ME, FL, etc, etc.
- kls 10y agoTo be fair we (FL) have had a horrible track record with mental health care for the better part of 5 decades. While I am no fan of Scott and his corruption the state of mental health care in FL has been on a slow roll downhill for a long time and both sides are just as culpable.
- emehrkay 10y agoRick Scott's administration passed a law that said welfare recipients must be drug tested in order to receive benefits. Rick Scott's family has a lot (~68/200 million) invested in some of those facilities.
- shepardrtc 10y agoAnd here is the initial result of all that: http://www.tampabay.com/news/courts/florida-didnt-save-money-by-drug-testing-welfare-recipients-data-shows/1225721 http://www.tampabay.com/news/courts/florida-didnt-save-money... Followed by the end of it: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/florida-declines-to-appeal-further-in-case-of-welfare-drug-testing/ http://www.cbsnews.com/news/florida-declines-to-appeal-furth...
- e40 10y agoI hope you don't get voted down, because it's just the way things are. It is really mind boggling how many GOP supporters try and deny this. What has happened in FL since the early 00's is just criminal. How opponents of Rick Scott couldn't get him ejected from office is a mystery to me, if it's not solely "money in politics."
- atria 10y agoI hope it gets voted down. It was John F. Kennedy that introduced the Community Mental Health act of 1963 to close down and defund mental institions. The idea of cutting spending for mental facilities was put forth by the Democratic party, not GOP. Both parties have continued ever since.
- __jal 10y agoBecause one political party, currently mostly ruling Florida, has made a core mission out of defunding anything that benefits anyone not already wealthy, not part of a small set of favored programs, or "defense"[1] spending. People with mental issues don't make political donations, rarely vote, and can't defend themselves. QED. [1] We can argue about which was really the the last defensive war fought by the US, but by any reasonable measure it is at least almost gone from living memory.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- cloudjacker 10y agoWhy would a political party in florida have anything to do with florida's budget on defense spending states don't spend any money on defense sounds like you had something to say, but got lost along the way
- __jal 10y agoPerhaps. Or perhaps you are choosing to interpret my words in a way that leads to a silly result. The much more obvious reading starts with noting that the party ruling Florida is the same party that also happens to have policy positions that are of a piece at the local, state and national level positions.
- jessaustin 10y agoIs that the party that invaded Libya? I get confused, on account of the two "big" ones seem identical to me.
- __jal 10y ago- If you're trolling, I have nothing to say. - If you're playing that game where overstating things for political effect because you [...], have fun, but I don't want to play. - If you actually believe that, either your priorities are so very far removed from mine that we have nothing to say to each other, or you have blinded yourself to a huge array of very real differences with very real effects on very real people. In which case, find someone else to argue with; I prefer to debate politics with people who live in the real world.
- maxxxxx 10y agoThe people will most likely end up in jail.