5 ms·

That's.......very passionate

kristopolous 10y ago
I honestly think, not to be insulting or childish but actually literal, that there's some part of many tech people's brain missing... Like Aspergers and ASD. (I'm certainly not a doctor) I feel that many tech people lack some human connection. I think this guides such aesthetics and its disavowing and denial of community and collective conscious. It's the only working hypothesis I can think of for why such decisions are proactively made and why such inordinate amounts of money are spent in such ways...work-world mcmansioning; a sanitized and saccharine white gloves of latex treatment. Maybe I need to form a more detailed pro-vision of what I mean instead of being all "no".
- tomc1985 10y ago
  It comes from living in a bubble with other nerds who deal with machines all day. The machines don't care, they don't have emotions. It's why techies have always struggled with the "human" aspects But what really kills me are the leaps in logic a lot of SV dips like to breathlessly promote to their users, who often genuinely look up to their tech lords and will take their words without further thought. Just the other day Yelp posted this whole screed about facilitating free speech rights (as in, preserving the freedom to review businesses on yelp), getting everybody fired up and diverting attention away from their shady advertising and business practices. All of this advocacy, all this diversity, all these stupid little bleeding-heart SJW tactics... ALL of them are red herrings for deeper agendas, which are often very weird on account of a prevalence of the personality attributes you've described.
  - Keyframe 10y ago
    It's also really interesting to note how many "tech people" are vocal about all sorts of things outside of their expertise. You will find 'techies' experts on everything, it seems. I'm still not sure if this behavioral anomaly is there in the first place or is it due to the nature of prevalent media that carries those voices.
    - tomc1985 10y ago
      I think it's arrogance. Programming has this weird allure where you think you understand the rest of the world.
      - kristopolous 10y ago
        I had an epiphany about 7 years ago that computers are only collective human effort. Everything you touch is an idea, thought, and implementation by some person. Programming ought to be a rich dive into cultural consciousness, like a sociologist living with some remote tribe. Instead, we get caught up in the fetishization and marvel of the machine itself; as if it all has descended from God and is part of nature. This is a detriment against seeing our part in the flow of the giant anarchistic relay race that is technology; when we dip our feet into this moving river we are part of the river as much as a twig or a rock - disrupting and modifying the flow; placing it in new directions. But only if we empower ourselves. Technology is anywhere from a culminate expression of culture to its artifact.
        ktRolster 10y ago
        I voted you up because, although I'm not entirely sure I agree with you, it was very eloquently said.
        kristopolous 10y ago
        Where else does software and hardware come from? The neighbor's clever dog? Some innovative robot? It's an expression of human culture. That's why the trendiest and not the most talented people are the most successful and why we currently and have always lived in an era of very fashionable fad software that isn't very good. It quickly gets superseded like fashion on a runway because that's what it is.
        ktRolster 10y ago
        The first paragraph is great. It's the next three that really get interesting.
  - kristopolous 10y ago
    It's like how the booze companies give money to mothers against drunk driving or the petrochemical companies say they are pro-environment. It's an attempt to seize the narrative and cover their misdeeds. Someone somewhere near the top has to care more about say, buying a fancy new cutlery set for lavish dinner parties, then the lives of people in their communities. We pretend like we've moved beyond the marie antoinettes, but we have them in spades.
    - errantspark 10y ago
      History is written by the victors, Marie Antoinette wasn't half as bad as the shallow popular perception of her makes her out to be. Everyone's got an agenda to push.
      - kristopolous 10y ago
        History is written within the context of the current power structure. Her caricature is the most recognizable allusion I could envisage for the idea. If there was a fantastic lever that would give you youthful skin at the cost of 100 lives in some remote village, I imagine there'd be a line that would extend far beyond the horizon.
- ktRolster 10y ago
  Have you ever been to Los Angeles? You might find the Hollywood-ization to be even worse. And frankly, the fakeness is everywhere.
  - kristopolous 10y ago
    I've lived there for almost a decade. In LA everyone knows it's fake, but in the bay people have bought into it. I feel like I'm at a Jim Jones camp and we're about to shoot down a congressman. I've heard the bay called the People's Temple more than once ... the word "cult" is tossed around a lot in the bay and it's an honest description every time. Also LA has a rich non-english, non-white environment. But I get it, it's not far enough. I've tried Portland and that's closer ... thinking of just packing up and trying Europe a bit; there has to be some humane place on the planet that fosters engagement and enrichment over private profit and expression over conformity. Somewhere over some rainbow...
    - ktRolster 10y ago
      there has to be some humane place on the planet that fosters engagement and enrichment over private profit and expression over conformity. No haha. If you want that, you have to carefully make friends who see more clearly. There are good people everywhere. (btw if you want a non-english, non-white environment in the bay area, go to 24-hour Fitness. I frequently have Spanish and Chinese conversations there. Occasionally Russian but less often).
    - freshhawk 10y ago
      If you find it, let me know. I think we're looking for the same thing.

I honestly think, not to be insulting or childish but actually literal, that there's some part of many tech people's brain missing... Like Aspergers and ASD. (I'm certainly not a doctor) I feel that many tech people lack some human connection. I think this guides such aesthetics and its disavowing and denial of community and collective conscious. It's the only working hypothesis I can think of for why such decisions are proactively made and why such inordinate amounts of money are spent in such ways...work-world mcmansioning; a sanitized and saccharine white gloves of latex treatment. Maybe I need to form a more detailed pro-vision of what I mean instead of being all "no".

tomc1985 10y ago
It comes from living in a bubble with other nerds who deal with machines all day. The machines don't care, they don't have emotions. It's why techies have always struggled with the "human" aspects But what really kills me are the leaps in logic a lot of SV dips like to breathlessly promote to their users, who often genuinely look up to their tech lords and will take their words without further thought. Just the other day Yelp posted this whole screed about facilitating free speech rights (as in, preserving the freedom to review businesses on yelp), getting everybody fired up and diverting attention away from their shady advertising and business practices. All of this advocacy, all this diversity, all these stupid little bleeding-heart SJW tactics... ALL of them are red herrings for deeper agendas, which are often very weird on account of a prevalence of the personality attributes you've described.
- Keyframe 10y ago
  It's also really interesting to note how many "tech people" are vocal about all sorts of things outside of their expertise. You will find 'techies' experts on everything, it seems. I'm still not sure if this behavioral anomaly is there in the first place or is it due to the nature of prevalent media that carries those voices.
  - tomc1985 10y ago
    I think it's arrogance. Programming has this weird allure where you think you understand the rest of the world.
    - kristopolous 10y ago
      I had an epiphany about 7 years ago that computers are only collective human effort. Everything you touch is an idea, thought, and implementation by some person. Programming ought to be a rich dive into cultural consciousness, like a sociologist living with some remote tribe. Instead, we get caught up in the fetishization and marvel of the machine itself; as if it all has descended from God and is part of nature. This is a detriment against seeing our part in the flow of the giant anarchistic relay race that is technology; when we dip our feet into this moving river we are part of the river as much as a twig or a rock - disrupting and modifying the flow; placing it in new directions. But only if we empower ourselves. Technology is anywhere from a culminate expression of culture to its artifact.
      - ktRolster 10y ago
        I voted you up because, although I'm not entirely sure I agree with you, it was very eloquently said.
        kristopolous 10y ago
        Where else does software and hardware come from? The neighbor's clever dog? Some innovative robot? It's an expression of human culture. That's why the trendiest and not the most talented people are the most successful and why we currently and have always lived in an era of very fashionable fad software that isn't very good. It quickly gets superseded like fashion on a runway because that's what it is.
        ktRolster 10y ago
        The first paragraph is great. It's the next three that really get interesting.
- kristopolous 10y ago
  It's like how the booze companies give money to mothers against drunk driving or the petrochemical companies say they are pro-environment. It's an attempt to seize the narrative and cover their misdeeds. Someone somewhere near the top has to care more about say, buying a fancy new cutlery set for lavish dinner parties, then the lives of people in their communities. We pretend like we've moved beyond the marie antoinettes, but we have them in spades.
  - errantspark 10y ago
    History is written by the victors, Marie Antoinette wasn't half as bad as the shallow popular perception of her makes her out to be. Everyone's got an agenda to push.
    - kristopolous 10y ago
      History is written within the context of the current power structure. Her caricature is the most recognizable allusion I could envisage for the idea. If there was a fantastic lever that would give you youthful skin at the cost of 100 lives in some remote village, I imagine there'd be a line that would extend far beyond the horizon.
ktRolster 10y ago
Have you ever been to Los Angeles? You might find the Hollywood-ization to be even worse. And frankly, the fakeness is everywhere.
- kristopolous 10y ago
  I've lived there for almost a decade. In LA everyone knows it's fake, but in the bay people have bought into it. I feel like I'm at a Jim Jones camp and we're about to shoot down a congressman. I've heard the bay called the People's Temple more than once ... the word "cult" is tossed around a lot in the bay and it's an honest description every time. Also LA has a rich non-english, non-white environment. But I get it, it's not far enough. I've tried Portland and that's closer ... thinking of just packing up and trying Europe a bit; there has to be some humane place on the planet that fosters engagement and enrichment over private profit and expression over conformity. Somewhere over some rainbow...
  - ktRolster 10y ago
    there has to be some humane place on the planet that fosters engagement and enrichment over private profit and expression over conformity. No haha. If you want that, you have to carefully make friends who see more clearly. There are good people everywhere. (btw if you want a non-english, non-white environment in the bay area, go to 24-hour Fitness. I frequently have Spanish and Chinese conversations there. Occasionally Russian but less often).
  - freshhawk 10y ago
    If you find it, let me know. I think we're looking for the same thing.