3 ms·

lets start by removing the labels of gen x and millennial. It's degrading. I personally try to not take age (or gender, race, clothing choice(please can we stop

lets start by removing the labels of gen x and millennial. It's degrading. I personally try to not take age (or gender, race, clothing choice(please can we stop with wearing suits and ties to interviews, it's dumb), or anything other than skills and culture fit) into account when interviewing people. But I can say that looking out over the people at the company I am at, it's mostly young people. Is that ageism? probably some but also, guess who costs more? old people. That's why older folks have a harder time getting hired. I also suspect that due to the glut of young kids coming into the market they will feel similar pains at trying to get hired just due to sheer numbers, and of course jerks who don't want those kids on their lawn.

cellularmitosis 10y ago
It is also easy to forget that more and more people are becoming programmers each year. The necessary result of this is that when you look at the average tech company, there will be fewer older programmers. "Uncle" Bob Martin once gave a talk where he asked for a show of hands of "How many of you have been programming for 5 years? 10 years? 15? 20?". The results in his audience roughly correlated to his thesis, that the number of programmers has roughly doubled every 5 years since programming was a thing. Are there fewer older programmers at a given company because of ageism? I'm sure that's part of it. But don't forget that there are far, far fewer programmers with 20 years of experience than with 5 years of experience.
- BatFastard 10y ago
  And if you got the choice of hiring someone with 5 year experience or 20, which would you choose?
  - TheOtherHobbes 10y ago
    It would depend on the kind of experience and the quality of insight. Time served doesn't correlate to quality. Programming is actually a very permissive industry. There are corporate environments in which you can be barely competent and still keep your job - if not gain promotions.
  - AnimalMuppet 10y ago
    Depends on whether they cost the same. If the experience costs more, does it bring enough value to the position I'm hiring for to be worth the cost? That's the key to getting a job with 20 years of experience. You need to be able to convince the hiring manager that you're worth the extra money in that job. (And then the hiring manager needs people above him that will let him spend the extra money.)
sokoloff 10y ago
There's nothing stopping you from not wearing a suit to an interview. I never have, and I don't believe it's hurt me one iota. The only candidates I see regularly wearing suits to interview are executives and college junior/seniors. I'm hiring you to code, not model. I couldn't care less what you're wearing as long as it's clean and reasonably respectable.
jpindar 10y ago
>who costs more? old people That's an ageist statement.

cellularmitosis 10y ago

It is also easy to forget that more and more people are becoming programmers each year. The necessary result of this is that when you look at the average tech company, there will be fewer older programmers. "Uncle" Bob Martin once gave a talk where he asked for a show of hands of "How many of you have been programming for 5 years? 10 years? 15? 20?". The results in his audience roughly correlated to his thesis, that the number of programmers has roughly doubled every 5 years since programming was a thing. Are there fewer older programmers at a given company because of ageism? I'm sure that's part of it. But don't forget that there are far, far fewer programmers with 20 years of experience than with 5 years of experience.

BatFastard 10y ago
And if you got the choice of hiring someone with 5 year experience or 20, which would you choose?
- TheOtherHobbes 10y ago
  It would depend on the kind of experience and the quality of insight. Time served doesn't correlate to quality. Programming is actually a very permissive industry. There are corporate environments in which you can be barely competent and still keep your job - if not gain promotions.
- AnimalMuppet 10y ago
  Depends on whether they cost the same. If the experience costs more, does it bring enough value to the position I'm hiring for to be worth the cost? That's the key to getting a job with 20 years of experience. You need to be able to convince the hiring manager that you're worth the extra money in that job. (And then the hiring manager needs people above him that will let him spend the extra money.)

sokoloff 10y ago

There's nothing stopping you from not wearing a suit to an interview. I never have, and I don't believe it's hurt me one iota. The only candidates I see regularly wearing suits to interview are executives and college junior/seniors. I'm hiring you to code, not model. I couldn't care less what you're wearing as long as it's clean and reasonably respectable.

jpindar 10y ago

>who costs more? old people That's an ageist statement.