5 ms·

Damn. With the state of most consumer mainboards, an EFI "payload" could leave the system "bricked". I know I've got one el-cheapo laptop that can't boot becaus

Damn. With the state of most consumer mainboards, an EFI "payload" could leave the system "bricked". I know I've got one el-cheapo laptop that can't boot because I made a mess of the EFI environment and there's no way to reset it.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
Zardoz84 10y ago
I'm begin to think that EFI is a very wrong turn way on modern computers.
- Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
  You're a bit behind the curve on this. EFI has been criticized for being horrendously complicated and gross since its inception.
  - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
    Obligatory Matthew Garrett quote from a Linux kernel EFI patch in 2011: UEFI stands for "Unified Extensible Firmware Interface", where "Firmware" is an ancient African word meaning "Why do something right when you can do it so wrong that children will weep and brave adults will cower before you", and "UEI" is Celtic for "We missed DOS so we burned it into your ROMs". https://lkml.org/lkml/2011/5/25/228 https://lkml.org/lkml/2011/5/25/228
    - yuhong 10y ago
      Even on servers, I noticed that HP (now HPE) began locking access to server UEFI updates soon after http://lkml.org/lkml/2013/11/11/653 http://lkml.org/lkml/2013/11/11/653 was posted.
- digi_owl 10y ago
  The PC platform as a whole is going through a severe case of "second system effect".
  - yuhong 10y ago
    Even back in the 1990s, there was ACPI. ACPI 1.0 for example dates back to the end of 1996 (of course before then there was drafts): http://uefi.org/sites/default/files/resources/ACPI_1.pdf http://uefi.org/sites/default/files/resources/ACPI_1.pdf But of course ACPI took years to catch on, during which low cost PCs from for example eMachines was coming.
    - digi_owl 10y ago
      I seem to recall Torvalds having some less than kind words about ACPI.
      - yuhong 10y ago
        I know. In fact, there is a reason I wonder what would have happened if Intel bought Compaq back in 1991 with Rod Canion and Jim Harris staying on.
yuhong 10y ago
I think you can easily do some of the UEFI DoS attacks directly from Windows without executing an EFI binary.
dogma1138 10y ago
Every desktop motherboard comes with a legacy bios, and virtually all of them come with a bios flashback USB port that can be used even without a CPU (it's used in cases where you fucked up the system completely, or you have a CPU which requires a newer bios). Laptops are another story.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

Zardoz84 10y ago

I'm begin to think that EFI is a very wrong turn way on modern computers.

Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
You're a bit behind the curve on this. EFI has been criticized for being horrendously complicated and gross since its inception.
- semi-extrinsic 10y ago
  Obligatory Matthew Garrett quote from a Linux kernel EFI patch in 2011: UEFI stands for "Unified Extensible Firmware Interface", where "Firmware" is an ancient African word meaning "Why do something right when you can do it so wrong that children will weep and brave adults will cower before you", and "UEI" is Celtic for "We missed DOS so we burned it into your ROMs". https://lkml.org/lkml/2011/5/25/228 https://lkml.org/lkml/2011/5/25/228
  - yuhong 10y ago
    Even on servers, I noticed that HP (now HPE) began locking access to server UEFI updates soon after http://lkml.org/lkml/2013/11/11/653 http://lkml.org/lkml/2013/11/11/653 was posted.
digi_owl 10y ago
The PC platform as a whole is going through a severe case of "second system effect".
- yuhong 10y ago
  Even back in the 1990s, there was ACPI. ACPI 1.0 for example dates back to the end of 1996 (of course before then there was drafts): http://uefi.org/sites/default/files/resources/ACPI_1.pdf http://uefi.org/sites/default/files/resources/ACPI_1.pdf But of course ACPI took years to catch on, during which low cost PCs from for example eMachines was coming.
  - digi_owl 10y ago
    I seem to recall Torvalds having some less than kind words about ACPI.
    - yuhong 10y ago
      I know. In fact, there is a reason I wonder what would have happened if Intel bought Compaq back in 1991 with Rod Canion and Jim Harris staying on.

yuhong 10y ago

I think you can easily do some of the UEFI DoS attacks directly from Windows without executing an EFI binary.

dogma1138 10y ago

Every desktop motherboard comes with a legacy bios, and virtually all of them come with a bios flashback USB port that can be used even without a CPU (it's used in cases where you fucked up the system completely, or you have a CPU which requires a newer bios). Laptops are another story.