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but its C—or a form of it—and it’s really hard to learn I personally prefer Javascript to Objective-C, but HTML, CSS and Javascript are not easier to learn tha

but its C—or a form of it—and it’s really hard to learn I personally prefer Javascript to Objective-C, but HTML, CSS and Javascript are not easier to learn than Cocoa and Objective-C. Objective-C and Cocoa are very will designed, simple tools.

ube 17y ago
True - they're not easier to learn but beyond the browser they are more applicable across different mobile platforms (i.e. Android, Blackberry). Objective-C and Cocoa will always be iPhone specific. I've been learning Objective-C though I wonder if my time would be better spent on javascript/html/css and usage of environments such as Titanium developer or Phonegap.
- mclin 17y ago
  Also, many many people already know JS/CSS/HTML, like me. I picked up phonegap and had my first app on the store in a week of spare time. But then I rewrote it with Titanium because it was kind of slow, which took at most another day. It felt like Christmas, and I found iPhone skillz under the tree. But now I want in-app-purchase, so I'm learning Obj-C... so the above was all for nothing.
  - voidfiles 17y ago
    Why can't you do in app purchase, with the titanium, or phonegap?
- _delirium 17y ago
  Although it's not particularly common, there's no real barrier to using Objective-C on any platform that has a gcc port, since it's one of the supported front-ends. If you liked it, you could use it to make native Linux apps, in lieu of C or C++ or whatever else you might use.
voidfiles 17y ago
I guess its different for different people, I just can't wrap my head around Obj-C, not sure why not.
- richcollins 17y ago
  If you ignore the C part its pretty much like any other OO class based language. You send messages to objects. The message causes a method to be activated. The method can access / set instance variables and send messages to other objects. Quite similar to Ruby, Python ... etc. Cocoa is also much simpler than the mess that is building applications using HTML, CSS and the DOM. It was designed specifically for the purpose that is used for, unlike web applications.
  - voidfiles 17y ago
    I don't think it would be all that difficult to learn the language of objective-c, but there is always more to learn the just a language. JS, HTML, CSS, require a brower, and a text-editor. I don't see many people building iPhone apps outside of xcode. And that stack seems to work well, but when a person who spends a lot of time with the browser model of development, try the xcode way of development, there can be a shock sometimes. Its a metaphore change, that can sometimes be hard to wrap your mind around. I also think it goes both ways. I would also argue that your premise that HTML, CSS, and JS were not designed for web applications, is invalid, because we can't just look at technologies for what they were suppose to be used for. Plenty of stuff has been developed for one thing, but ended up doing another.
    - richcollins 17y ago
      It wasn't used because it was well suited for the task. It was used in spite of its limitations because it doesn't require software installation. This made such a huge difference in uptake, that it didn't matter that the user experience was inferior in many other ways.

ube 17y ago

True - they're not easier to learn but beyond the browser they are more applicable across different mobile platforms (i.e. Android, Blackberry). Objective-C and Cocoa will always be iPhone specific. I've been learning Objective-C though I wonder if my time would be better spent on javascript/html/css and usage of environments such as Titanium developer or Phonegap.

mclin 17y ago
Also, many many people already know JS/CSS/HTML, like me. I picked up phonegap and had my first app on the store in a week of spare time. But then I rewrote it with Titanium because it was kind of slow, which took at most another day. It felt like Christmas, and I found iPhone skillz under the tree. But now I want in-app-purchase, so I'm learning Obj-C... so the above was all for nothing.
- voidfiles 17y ago
  Why can't you do in app purchase, with the titanium, or phonegap?
_delirium 17y ago
Although it's not particularly common, there's no real barrier to using Objective-C on any platform that has a gcc port, since it's one of the supported front-ends. If you liked it, you could use it to make native Linux apps, in lieu of C or C++ or whatever else you might use.

voidfiles 17y ago

I guess its different for different people, I just can't wrap my head around Obj-C, not sure why not.

richcollins 17y ago
If you ignore the C part its pretty much like any other OO class based language. You send messages to objects. The message causes a method to be activated. The method can access / set instance variables and send messages to other objects. Quite similar to Ruby, Python ... etc. Cocoa is also much simpler than the mess that is building applications using HTML, CSS and the DOM. It was designed specifically for the purpose that is used for, unlike web applications.
- voidfiles 17y ago
  I don't think it would be all that difficult to learn the language of objective-c, but there is always more to learn the just a language. JS, HTML, CSS, require a brower, and a text-editor. I don't see many people building iPhone apps outside of xcode. And that stack seems to work well, but when a person who spends a lot of time with the browser model of development, try the xcode way of development, there can be a shock sometimes. Its a metaphore change, that can sometimes be hard to wrap your mind around. I also think it goes both ways. I would also argue that your premise that HTML, CSS, and JS were not designed for web applications, is invalid, because we can't just look at technologies for what they were suppose to be used for. Plenty of stuff has been developed for one thing, but ended up doing another.
  - richcollins 17y ago
    It wasn't used because it was well suited for the task. It was used in spite of its limitations because it doesn't require software installation. This made such a huge difference in uptake, that it didn't matter that the user experience was inferior in many other ways.