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guess I should also write the other side of the story -- things I don't like about China. Overall, I feel that China is like the U.S. in its early days (1920s)

guess I should also write the other side of the story -- things I don't like about China. Overall, I feel that China is like the U.S. in its early days (1920s). Or the 1999 Silicon Valley There are a lot of opportunities, but less rules. It's a jungle basically. For people with tech depth and want to build something steadily, China is not the best place. a high percentage of young entrepreneurs there are just opportunists. They are not interested in sitting down and building something useful. Instead, they just want to quickly raise/burn money and go public. There are way more theranos' there in China. And you need to have connections to success in China. This is a historical and cultural thing. I don't know how many of you noticed the recent news of didi acquiring uber China. The leaders of the two companies are actually from the same family. One is the daughter of the Lenovo CEO. The other is the niece of him. Probably coincidence，but you see coincidences more often in China. My attitude towards China is that I take it seriously. I admit what it does better. But I don't think I'm strong enough to fight in the jungle.

eric-hu 10y ago
I would like to see more of this kind of "Here's how I see it in the positive and negative" discussion on HN. Kudos for sharing the opposing sides of your own opinion.
Asetsuna 10y ago
To be fair, you can get success more easily in US if you have connections which is the same as China. Maybe Bill Gate and his mother's background is a similar example to what you referred about DiDi.
- xiaoma 10y ago
  Don't be ridiculous. If it were actually the same, then Bill Gates could have used his influence to get Netscape's site blocked from the internet or depending on the depth of his connections with Bill Clinton at the time, get Marc Andreessen thrown in prison. For those who do manage to become billionaires, the game often becomes even rougher: http://www.forbes.com/sites/raykwong/2011/07/25/friends-dont-let-friends-become-chinese-billionaires/#749f921d11fd http://www.forbes.com/sites/raykwong/2011/07/25/friends-dont...
- billconan 10y ago
  That's true. But on the other hand, you seldom see people in Silicon Valley are actually from the valley. They are immigrants from different states and countries. They abandoned their connections (especially family connections) from home to start over here. Many of them became successful. China simply doesn't have the same soil for this kind of success.
smallbag 10y ago
I find it funny, what you describe looks like Silicon Valley
- billconan 10y ago
  not the same level tough. at least, SV is the birth place of many hardcore tech companies like intel.
- hx87 10y ago
  Social connections to government officials matter a bit less in SV, and family connections much less.
erikb 10y ago
Same here. I think startups everywhere are a jungle, but in China it's a lot deeper, much deeper. Tricks, politics, family, all of that plays a much bigger role and luck can change much more quickly. I don't know how it is in Shanghai but in the countryside it's also still possible that you need to deal with mob like groups that will simply put you in the hospital if they feel you are disturbing their business.
- 20andup 10y ago
  Where do you live?
20andup 10y ago
"a high percentage of young entrepreneurs there are just opportunists. They are not interested in sitting down and building something useful. Instead, they just want to quickly raise/burn money and go public." I worked for several SF startups and most are the same. So I don't agree there are way more Theranos' in China. I would say they are probably around the same level in terms of many people claiming they are for something when they are not. This doesn't just happen in tech though. I have seen it in banking as well when it was booming. When there is a booming industry, it tends to attract a lot of posers that exasperates the hype.
- billconan 10y ago
  I agree, although China is worse by few levels I think. I see this phenomena everywhere in China. I can't tell where Chinese silicon valley and wall street are. running start-ups has become a all-people movement.
chenster 10y ago
"...a high percentage of young entrepreneurs there are just opportunists." sounds like Wall Street, the same difference.

eric-hu 10y ago

I would like to see more of this kind of "Here's how I see it in the positive and negative" discussion on HN. Kudos for sharing the opposing sides of your own opinion.

Asetsuna 10y ago

To be fair, you can get success more easily in US if you have connections which is the same as China. Maybe Bill Gate and his mother's background is a similar example to what you referred about DiDi.

xiaoma 10y ago
Don't be ridiculous. If it were actually the same, then Bill Gates could have used his influence to get Netscape's site blocked from the internet or depending on the depth of his connections with Bill Clinton at the time, get Marc Andreessen thrown in prison. For those who do manage to become billionaires, the game often becomes even rougher: http://www.forbes.com/sites/raykwong/2011/07/25/friends-dont-let-friends-become-chinese-billionaires/#749f921d11fd http://www.forbes.com/sites/raykwong/2011/07/25/friends-dont...
billconan 10y ago
That's true. But on the other hand, you seldom see people in Silicon Valley are actually from the valley. They are immigrants from different states and countries. They abandoned their connections (especially family connections) from home to start over here. Many of them became successful. China simply doesn't have the same soil for this kind of success.

smallbag 10y ago

I find it funny, what you describe looks like Silicon Valley

billconan 10y ago
not the same level tough. at least, SV is the birth place of many hardcore tech companies like intel.
hx87 10y ago
Social connections to government officials matter a bit less in SV, and family connections much less.

erikb 10y ago

Same here. I think startups everywhere are a jungle, but in China it's a lot deeper, much deeper. Tricks, politics, family, all of that plays a much bigger role and luck can change much more quickly. I don't know how it is in Shanghai but in the countryside it's also still possible that you need to deal with mob like groups that will simply put you in the hospital if they feel you are disturbing their business.

20andup 10y ago
Where do you live?

20andup 10y ago

"a high percentage of young entrepreneurs there are just opportunists. They are not interested in sitting down and building something useful. Instead, they just want to quickly raise/burn money and go public." I worked for several SF startups and most are the same. So I don't agree there are way more Theranos' in China. I would say they are probably around the same level in terms of many people claiming they are for something when they are not. This doesn't just happen in tech though. I have seen it in banking as well when it was booming. When there is a booming industry, it tends to attract a lot of posers that exasperates the hype.

billconan 10y ago
I agree, although China is worse by few levels I think. I see this phenomena everywhere in China. I can't tell where Chinese silicon valley and wall street are. running start-ups has become a all-people movement.

chenster 10y ago

"...a high percentage of young entrepreneurs there are just opportunists." sounds like Wall Street, the same difference.