5 ms·

Opiates are not anywhere nearly as harmful as alcohol. Apart from overdosing, there's very little side effect, generally. (Some people don't tolerate them well.

Opiates are not anywhere nearly as harmful as alcohol. Apart from overdosing, there's very little side effect, generally. (Some people don't tolerate them well.) The health issues that junkies have is usually due to poor hygiene - many places don't even let them buy needles! The legal aspects cause all of this. They raise prices, make supply hard, encourage fraud, discourage help, increase the terrible social stigma. There are millions of legal users that are doing fine - hundreds of millions of prescriptions! On top of this, it's an affront to the concept of individual freedom to deny medicine to patients just because you don't like them or have labelled them an addict. The current system encourages for-profit gatekeepers.

Aelinsaar 10y ago
I'm curious, you seem very passionate about this topic, why is that?
- MichaelGG 10y ago
  I know a fair amount of people that have used, some that died. I've been robbed by a relative so he could sell my shit to buy drugs. Yet I strongly believe that people should be able to make their own decisions, that personal freedoms are worth the price of people deciding to use whatever medicine they want. In this thread there's a lot of blaming of a chemical. There's a lot of blaming people getting caught by laws. Jaywalking is more dangerous to third parties than these drugs, yet we would not accept this kind of attitude toward jaywalkers. People conflate the situation of drug use with the actual effects of substance. Even in this thread there's people bemoaning that junkies will do anything. While failing to acknowledge it's purely an artificial constraint that creates this situation in the first place. Antibiotics are far more dangerous. It provides a serious threat to everyone, even those that don't engage. Where are the task forces raiding and jailing people for that? I can personally go purchase a 4th line antibiotic in about 20 minutes, but I can't get strong pain relievers? The war on drugs, including (perhaps most importantly) the social attitudes, keeps countries in poverty and disarray. Look at Latin America, and how much money and blood, crime and fear is caused by this idiocy. Yet much of the population still views "dealers" and "drug traffickers" as inherently vile. In some countries, they have basically no drug user issues, yet they pay this ridiculous price. I find it abhorrent to have for-profit gatekeepers deciding what people cannot do with their own bodies (or possessions for that matter). It's far worse than say, DRM or Apple-style device lockdown. Edit: Perhaps I'm also excitable. I'd probably get annoyed if commenters kept repeating that "function" was a fine length for the lambda keyword/syntax, while simultaneously saying lambdas are too verbose.
  - Aelinsaar 10y ago
    I appreciate the detailed answer, thanks.
tigershark 10y ago
This is probably the biggest lie that I ever heard in my life. Go on and take your opiates if makes you happy, but don't try to deny reality. Alcohol is assumed every day by billions people in the world and it has absolutely no harmful effects if taken moderately. Actually there are several studies about the healthy effect of one glass of wine a day. A junkie instead cannot take his sh.t with moderation and will suffer plenty of ill effects.
- ryanlol 10y ago
  Opiates are consumed every day by tens of millions of people in the world and they have absolutely no harmful effects if taken according to prescription. That opiates when used in proper doses are extremely safe from a physical point of view is an indisputable fact.
  - tigershark 10y ago
    For pain relief, not for getting high.
    - MichaelGG 10y ago
      There's basically no difference. Chronic pain users will end up on ever higher doses and get rx's with amounts that'll make junkies jealous. Severe pain might make them even more tolerant to the drug. Even then: I've had IV morphine at the hospital after getting my knee run through. I was high as hell. I've had hydrocodone given to me after hurting my back. Totally high, blissed out. Seems to be the common complaint: "I got pain pills, but they made me loopy!" It's like when people say meth (or Adderall or Ritalin) works differently on people with ADHD. No it doesn't, they're just coming from a different baseline. It'll help anyone think better. There might be some long-term problems with opiate use. Like reduced testosterone. Maybe reduced immunity (hard to tell, since so many chronic pain patients have severe illness). Prolonged constipation can certainly cause issues, too.
- opiatethrowaway 10y ago
  You're completely off base here. Many times more people die of alcohol than heroin and prescription analogs put together. Also, there are tons of people who use opiates responsibly and in moderation--I'm one of them. Finally, lose the anger, it's a symptom of alcoholism ;)

Aelinsaar 10y ago

I'm curious, you seem very passionate about this topic, why is that?

MichaelGG 10y ago
I know a fair amount of people that have used, some that died. I've been robbed by a relative so he could sell my shit to buy drugs. Yet I strongly believe that people should be able to make their own decisions, that personal freedoms are worth the price of people deciding to use whatever medicine they want. In this thread there's a lot of blaming of a chemical. There's a lot of blaming people getting caught by laws. Jaywalking is more dangerous to third parties than these drugs, yet we would not accept this kind of attitude toward jaywalkers. People conflate the situation of drug use with the actual effects of substance. Even in this thread there's people bemoaning that junkies will do anything. While failing to acknowledge it's purely an artificial constraint that creates this situation in the first place. Antibiotics are far more dangerous. It provides a serious threat to everyone, even those that don't engage. Where are the task forces raiding and jailing people for that? I can personally go purchase a 4th line antibiotic in about 20 minutes, but I can't get strong pain relievers? The war on drugs, including (perhaps most importantly) the social attitudes, keeps countries in poverty and disarray. Look at Latin America, and how much money and blood, crime and fear is caused by this idiocy. Yet much of the population still views "dealers" and "drug traffickers" as inherently vile. In some countries, they have basically no drug user issues, yet they pay this ridiculous price. I find it abhorrent to have for-profit gatekeepers deciding what people cannot do with their own bodies (or possessions for that matter). It's far worse than say, DRM or Apple-style device lockdown. Edit: Perhaps I'm also excitable. I'd probably get annoyed if commenters kept repeating that "function" was a fine length for the lambda keyword/syntax, while simultaneously saying lambdas are too verbose.
- Aelinsaar 10y ago
  I appreciate the detailed answer, thanks.

tigershark 10y ago

This is probably the biggest lie that I ever heard in my life. Go on and take your opiates if makes you happy, but don't try to deny reality. Alcohol is assumed every day by billions people in the world and it has absolutely no harmful effects if taken moderately. Actually there are several studies about the healthy effect of one glass of wine a day. A junkie instead cannot take his sh.t with moderation and will suffer plenty of ill effects.

ryanlol 10y ago
Opiates are consumed every day by tens of millions of people in the world and they have absolutely no harmful effects if taken according to prescription. That opiates when used in proper doses are extremely safe from a physical point of view is an indisputable fact.
- tigershark 10y ago
  For pain relief, not for getting high.
  - MichaelGG 10y ago
    There's basically no difference. Chronic pain users will end up on ever higher doses and get rx's with amounts that'll make junkies jealous. Severe pain might make them even more tolerant to the drug. Even then: I've had IV morphine at the hospital after getting my knee run through. I was high as hell. I've had hydrocodone given to me after hurting my back. Totally high, blissed out. Seems to be the common complaint: "I got pain pills, but they made me loopy!" It's like when people say meth (or Adderall or Ritalin) works differently on people with ADHD. No it doesn't, they're just coming from a different baseline. It'll help anyone think better. There might be some long-term problems with opiate use. Like reduced testosterone. Maybe reduced immunity (hard to tell, since so many chronic pain patients have severe illness). Prolonged constipation can certainly cause issues, too.
opiatethrowaway 10y ago
You're completely off base here. Many times more people die of alcohol than heroin and prescription analogs put together. Also, there are tons of people who use opiates responsibly and in moderation--I'm one of them. Finally, lose the anger, it's a symptom of alcoholism ;)