4 ms·

$200k-$300k in places like San Francisco and Menlo Park. Clearly, you don't understand how cost of living works. Also, to make that much, you need to be at arou

by dvt 10y ago

$200k-$300k in places like San Francisco and Menlo Park. Clearly, you don't understand how cost of living works. Also, to make that much, you need to be at around a level of SDE3/tech lead, which is by no means easy (a decade of making low six-figures & some political panache). See this top answer on Quora, for a pretty detailed analysis: https://www.quora.com/Will-I-be-able-to-become-a-millionaire-by-working-at-a-big-Software-company-like-Google-Facebook-Microsoft-etc-all-my-life https://www.quora.com/Will-I-be-able-to-become-a-millionaire... You might be able to become a millionaire in 25 years assuming a frugal lifestyle and no big life event costs, but that's optimistic.

morgante 10y ago
You can argue all you want, but I understand how cost of living works plenty well. SV is expensive but not so expensive that it wipes out $200k in income. If you're careful about expenses you can easily put away tens of thousands annually. This is backed up by own personal experience as a developer in NYC (hardly a low cost area). I expect to have a million dollars saved up within a decade and I certainly haven't relied on political panache to get there.
- dvt 10y ago
  Sorry for seeming incredulous, but if you're saying that you're saving 100k a year in NYC, then you must be making like 400k or living in a cardboard box. Even with a 300k salary, you could only save 10k a month if you only had 5k worth of monthly expenses (3-4k is easily rent in NYC). And keep in mind that making 300k-400k is not typical.
  - morgante 10y ago
    I make substantially less than 400k and I assure you that I do not live in a cardboard box. $5k is high for monthly expenses. I rented a single bedroom in Manhattan for $1850 and you can save even more if you're willing to live with roommates. I'm not sure what I can do to convince you I'm not lying, but consider that median household income is less than $100k in both SV and NY. If the average person can get by on <$100k, why wouldn't you be able to save tons of money if you're making $200k? I have friends getting by on $40k in NYC. Can you imagine how easy it is to save if you match your lifestyle to theirs? Of course, it's not going to buy you a luxury lifestyle. But personally I'd rather maintain a high savings rate than live in a glitzy apartment and spend thousands on bottle service.
    - dvt 10y ago
      Ok, so maybe I'm just bad at math. I know that if you make 200k as an engineer in NYC (which is STILL high[1]), you make around 10k a month after taxes. 10k - 2k for rent - 1k for expenses = 7k saved if you don't go on vacation, and literally do nothing that costs money for ten years. Even saving 7k a month, you won't save 100k a year. [1] https://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/new-york-city-software-engineer-salary-SRCH_IL.0,13_IM615_KO14,31.htm https://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/new-york-city-software-en...
      - morgante 10y ago
        7k is about right. My average savings rate over the past 3 years has been $6k and it's increased as my salary has. You're forgetting to include investment gains. With them, I can go on regular vacations and still reach $1m within 10 years. Also, since someone else mentioned it, my model conservatively assumes a 4% inflation rate. Over the 3 years I've been tracking, my model has consistently underestimated the growth in my savings.
      - riboflava 10y ago
        $1k for other 'expenses' is huge. You can drive that down at least by half with wiser spending.
        foldr 10y ago
        It's not huge. That's bills together with all of your everyday spending. It's certainly possible to get that down to less than $1000 a month but you can easily spend $1000 a month without doing anything extravagant.
        dvt 10y ago
        Food, insurance, gas, water, electricity, student debt, etc. At least by half? Come on. Let's be real.
        eru 10y ago
        You might want to save, but there's no need to be a total miser on any >100k salary.
  - hx87 10y ago
    > 3-4k is easily rent in NYC Only if you insist on living by yourself, or renting a luxury apartment with your friends/family in Manhattan. Going under $2k a month is easily possible if you have a large, multiple earner family or roommates, especially if you live outside Manhattan/Brooklyn. Plenty of New Yorkers manage with incomes less than $60k, and if you can live like them, saving 10k a month on a $300,000 salary is easy. There is nothing requiring you to spend a certain amount of money just because you are earning a certain amount of money. We don't have sumptuary laws, after all.
- chronic81 10y ago
  > I expect to have a million dollars saved up within a decade and I certainly haven't relied on political panache to get there. In 10 years, your "million" will be worth 800K now. Not everyone wants to sit around for decades to become a millionaire.
the8bit 10y ago
A lot of people make TL within 5-7 years, its not that uncommon (although we are talking about top 1-5% of programmers). Saving $1MM on west coast salary in 10 years is really doable. I am on track to do it in effectively 7 years or so.

by dvt 10y ago

morgante 10y ago

You can argue all you want, but I understand how cost of living works plenty well. SV is expensive but not so expensive that it wipes out $200k in income. If you're careful about expenses you can easily put away tens of thousands annually. This is backed up by own personal experience as a developer in NYC (hardly a low cost area). I expect to have a million dollars saved up within a decade and I certainly haven't relied on political panache to get there.

dvt 10y ago
Sorry for seeming incredulous, but if you're saying that you're saving 100k a year in NYC, then you must be making like 400k or living in a cardboard box. Even with a 300k salary, you could only save 10k a month if you only had 5k worth of monthly expenses (3-4k is easily rent in NYC). And keep in mind that making 300k-400k is not typical.
- morgante 10y ago
  I make substantially less than 400k and I assure you that I do not live in a cardboard box. $5k is high for monthly expenses. I rented a single bedroom in Manhattan for $1850 and you can save even more if you're willing to live with roommates. I'm not sure what I can do to convince you I'm not lying, but consider that median household income is less than $100k in both SV and NY. If the average person can get by on <$100k, why wouldn't you be able to save tons of money if you're making $200k? I have friends getting by on $40k in NYC. Can you imagine how easy it is to save if you match your lifestyle to theirs? Of course, it's not going to buy you a luxury lifestyle. But personally I'd rather maintain a high savings rate than live in a glitzy apartment and spend thousands on bottle service.
  - dvt 10y ago
    Ok, so maybe I'm just bad at math. I know that if you make 200k as an engineer in NYC (which is STILL high[1]), you make around 10k a month after taxes. 10k - 2k for rent - 1k for expenses = 7k saved if you don't go on vacation, and literally do nothing that costs money for ten years. Even saving 7k a month, you won't save 100k a year. [1] https://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/new-york-city-software-engineer-salary-SRCH_IL.0,13_IM615_KO14,31.htm https://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/new-york-city-software-en...
    - morgante 10y ago
      7k is about right. My average savings rate over the past 3 years has been $6k and it's increased as my salary has. You're forgetting to include investment gains. With them, I can go on regular vacations and still reach $1m within 10 years. Also, since someone else mentioned it, my model conservatively assumes a 4% inflation rate. Over the 3 years I've been tracking, my model has consistently underestimated the growth in my savings.
    - riboflava 10y ago
      $1k for other 'expenses' is huge. You can drive that down at least by half with wiser spending.
      - foldr 10y ago
        It's not huge. That's bills together with all of your everyday spending. It's certainly possible to get that down to less than $1000 a month but you can easily spend $1000 a month without doing anything extravagant.
      - dvt 10y ago
        Food, insurance, gas, water, electricity, student debt, etc. At least by half? Come on. Let's be real.
      - eru 10y ago
        You might want to save, but there's no need to be a total miser on any >100k salary.
- hx87 10y ago
  > 3-4k is easily rent in NYC Only if you insist on living by yourself, or renting a luxury apartment with your friends/family in Manhattan. Going under $2k a month is easily possible if you have a large, multiple earner family or roommates, especially if you live outside Manhattan/Brooklyn. Plenty of New Yorkers manage with incomes less than $60k, and if you can live like them, saving 10k a month on a $300,000 salary is easy. There is nothing requiring you to spend a certain amount of money just because you are earning a certain amount of money. We don't have sumptuary laws, after all.
chronic81 10y ago
> I expect to have a million dollars saved up within a decade and I certainly haven't relied on political panache to get there. In 10 years, your "million" will be worth 800K now. Not everyone wants to sit around for decades to become a millionaire.

the8bit 10y ago

A lot of people make TL within 5-7 years, its not that uncommon (although we are talking about top 1-5% of programmers). Saving $1MM on west coast salary in 10 years is really doable. I am on track to do it in effectively 7 years or so.