7 ms·

This has been done for quite some time, and it's unclear what value deep learning would add beyond the arithmetic we've used for a while. https://en.wikipedia.

This has been done for quite some time, and it's unclear what value deep learning would add beyond the arithmetic we've used for a while. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_timing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signal_timing Major cities have Transit Operations Centers or similar where engineers watch road camera and sensor data (as well as local news and other sources of information) and direct traffic lights, gates, police, etc. to keep things moving. There was actually a controversy in London when this control room manipulated traffic lights so the International Olympic Committee officials evaluating London would always hit green lights, and perceive the traffic as better than it actually was. This may be less apparent in some areas because it is actually done with the opposite intention: to slow things down. If you seem to be hitting every red light, it is probably because the local government decided to install a Traffic Calming program there in the interest of safety / fewer complaints from the neighbors.

EGreg 10y ago
If I was running for mayor of NYC I would focus my campaign heavily on cleaning up the traffic: 1) Negotiate with all those stores to move deliveries to night-time. So more parking opens up and they don't clog the streets. Any losses from eg tax breaks would be more than offset by the increased productivity. 2) Reward companies that allow employees to work from home one day a week, or that organize carpooling for employees. Install wifi in city subway CARS and run a campaign targeting companies letting them know their employees are more productive on the train with both hands free than stuck in traffic. 3) Get an official app for the city to let drivers know when parking spots open up. 30% of traffic in the city is cars circling around looking for parking. Charge a monthly fee for the app, and allow paying for parking via the app. However, I probably wouldn't want to allow people to renew their parking past 2 hours so the city could still make revenue from people who overstay. Also prevents people hogging the spots. 4) Apply the results of traffic research to tunnels and bridges which have heavy delays. Make all the traffic lights leading up to the tunnel reward 20mph driving, while at the tunnel exits it would reward 30mph driving. It's easy to force traffic to preset speeds like this using traffic lights, and you could do this for several blocks leading up to and away from the tunnels. In short - less frustration, less pollution, less circling around, people get to where they want faster, make more money and city is better off.
- superuser2 10y ago
  Street parking is just a terrible experience all around. I'd prefer to see most street parking eliminated in favor of dedicated rights-of-way for bikes, buses, taxis, rideshare, etc. If you want to have a car, you have to live somewhere that has an alley/garage space for you. If you want your business to be usable by drivers, have a parking lot or do a parking validation deal with a nearby garage. I think the SpotHero/ParkWhiz model is very cool, would love to see it turn into a real-time auction with very precise competitive demand-based pricing. "Parking is surging right now, consider taking UberPool for $x less." I already don't drive anywhere in Chicago unless I know there's an adequately sized parking lot, or I've booked reasonably priced parking ahead of time. Seeing ahead of time that there is no reasonably priced parking generally makes me take the CTA, whereas otherwise I might have circled for a while before breaking down and paying $25.
  - finid 10y ago
    > If you want to have a car, you have to live somewhere that has an alley/garage space for you. You're obviously not referring to NYC.
    - Symbiote 10y ago
      Why not? That's the case in the centres of many European cities.
      - finid 10y ago
        NYC is different. Most parking is street parking, or a paid garage parking, which can be expensive.
        Symbiote 10y ago
        > Most parking is street parking That's a decision the city has made, and the current state of much street-space in NYC. Copenhagen has made the opposite decision: space in the city centre is allocated to bicycle lanes and footpaths on many streets. I live on such a street. If I bought a car, I'd need to rent a parking space. London has an intermediate approach: resident parking on the street requires an expensive permit.
Natsu 10y ago
Yeah, but the funny thing about the all red timing that I've seen is that people can beat it by going faster than they should, which always struck me as wrong.
- eximius 10y ago
  I do exactly this. :/
WalterBright 10y ago
> This has been done for quite some time, and it's unclear what value deep learning would add beyond the arithmetic we've used for a while. I've seen a lot of these claims, and they're easily debunked by driving through a city. The usual case is a platoon of 5 cars cruising down an arterial. A solitary car pulls up on a side street, and the light turns read for the arterial just in time to stop the platoon for the solitary car. A sensible algorithm would let the platoon pass first. There are endless scenarios of these, to the point where the light algorithm finds a local optima where it is completely out of phase with the traffic and causes maximum delay and minimum throughput. A relatively small amount of effort going into cameras and an adaptive system that minimizes a cost function would save billions of dollars in gas, time, and unneeded road widening.
- Buttons840 10y ago
  There are two scenarios that inevitably get me thinking about smarter traffic lights. The first, is what you described, and the second is when I notice myself and a few others are sitting at a stop light while the intersection remains unused for 30 seconds.
- gwbas1c 10y ago
  Santa Clara, CA trumps out "retime the traffic lights" every time they want to raise taxes. Biggest crock of B.S. I've seen in a ballot.
- asynchronous13 10y ago
  > A sensible algorithm would let the platoon pass first. You're taking an example of a sub-optimal local solution and claiming that is proof that the global solution is sub-optimal. That does not follow. It could easily be, taking your example, that the platoon of 5 cars must stop at some future light, and the delay for 1 car is the smallest delay available for those cars. Therefore, stopping for the 1 car reduces the platoon's total travel time. As the driver, it's easy to think that was dumb because you'll never see the 15-car wait that was avoided by stopping early for 1 car. Essentially, you are claiming that a greedy algorithm for traffic would always find the globally optimal solution (which we know is not true).

EGreg 10y ago

If I was running for mayor of NYC I would focus my campaign heavily on cleaning up the traffic: 1) Negotiate with all those stores to move deliveries to night-time. So more parking opens up and they don't clog the streets. Any losses from eg tax breaks would be more than offset by the increased productivity. 2) Reward companies that allow employees to work from home one day a week, or that organize carpooling for employees. Install wifi in city subway CARS and run a campaign targeting companies letting them know their employees are more productive on the train with both hands free than stuck in traffic. 3) Get an official app for the city to let drivers know when parking spots open up. 30% of traffic in the city is cars circling around looking for parking. Charge a monthly fee for the app, and allow paying for parking via the app. However, I probably wouldn't want to allow people to renew their parking past 2 hours so the city could still make revenue from people who overstay. Also prevents people hogging the spots. 4) Apply the results of traffic research to tunnels and bridges which have heavy delays. Make all the traffic lights leading up to the tunnel reward 20mph driving, while at the tunnel exits it would reward 30mph driving. It's easy to force traffic to preset speeds like this using traffic lights, and you could do this for several blocks leading up to and away from the tunnels. In short - less frustration, less pollution, less circling around, people get to where they want faster, make more money and city is better off.

superuser2 10y ago
Street parking is just a terrible experience all around. I'd prefer to see most street parking eliminated in favor of dedicated rights-of-way for bikes, buses, taxis, rideshare, etc. If you want to have a car, you have to live somewhere that has an alley/garage space for you. If you want your business to be usable by drivers, have a parking lot or do a parking validation deal with a nearby garage. I think the SpotHero/ParkWhiz model is very cool, would love to see it turn into a real-time auction with very precise competitive demand-based pricing. "Parking is surging right now, consider taking UberPool for $x less." I already don't drive anywhere in Chicago unless I know there's an adequately sized parking lot, or I've booked reasonably priced parking ahead of time. Seeing ahead of time that there is no reasonably priced parking generally makes me take the CTA, whereas otherwise I might have circled for a while before breaking down and paying $25.
- finid 10y ago
  > If you want to have a car, you have to live somewhere that has an alley/garage space for you. You're obviously not referring to NYC.
  - Symbiote 10y ago
    Why not? That's the case in the centres of many European cities.
    - finid 10y ago
      NYC is different. Most parking is street parking, or a paid garage parking, which can be expensive.
      - Symbiote 10y ago
        > Most parking is street parking That's a decision the city has made, and the current state of much street-space in NYC. Copenhagen has made the opposite decision: space in the city centre is allocated to bicycle lanes and footpaths on many streets. I live on such a street. If I bought a car, I'd need to rent a parking space. London has an intermediate approach: resident parking on the street requires an expensive permit.

Natsu 10y ago

Yeah, but the funny thing about the all red timing that I've seen is that people can beat it by going faster than they should, which always struck me as wrong.

eximius 10y ago
I do exactly this. :/

WalterBright 10y ago

> This has been done for quite some time, and it's unclear what value deep learning would add beyond the arithmetic we've used for a while. I've seen a lot of these claims, and they're easily debunked by driving through a city. The usual case is a platoon of 5 cars cruising down an arterial. A solitary car pulls up on a side street, and the light turns read for the arterial just in time to stop the platoon for the solitary car. A sensible algorithm would let the platoon pass first. There are endless scenarios of these, to the point where the light algorithm finds a local optima where it is completely out of phase with the traffic and causes maximum delay and minimum throughput. A relatively small amount of effort going into cameras and an adaptive system that minimizes a cost function would save billions of dollars in gas, time, and unneeded road widening.

Buttons840 10y ago
There are two scenarios that inevitably get me thinking about smarter traffic lights. The first, is what you described, and the second is when I notice myself and a few others are sitting at a stop light while the intersection remains unused for 30 seconds.
gwbas1c 10y ago
Santa Clara, CA trumps out "retime the traffic lights" every time they want to raise taxes. Biggest crock of B.S. I've seen in a ballot.
asynchronous13 10y ago
> A sensible algorithm would let the platoon pass first. You're taking an example of a sub-optimal local solution and claiming that is proof that the global solution is sub-optimal. That does not follow. It could easily be, taking your example, that the platoon of 5 cars must stop at some future light, and the delay for 1 car is the smallest delay available for those cars. Therefore, stopping for the 1 car reduces the platoon's total travel time. As the driver, it's easy to think that was dumb because you'll never see the 15-car wait that was avoided by stopping early for 1 car. Essentially, you are claiming that a greedy algorithm for traffic would always find the globally optimal solution (which we know is not true).