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Well, a part of the problem obviously is that it's "throwing the book at people already committing crimes" in a place where the definition of a "crime" is not v

Well, a part of the problem obviously is that it's "throwing the book at people already committing crimes" in a place where the definition of a "crime" is not very reasonable. For instance, a woman getting raped is defined as "extramarital sex" which is a crime. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/26/hundreds-of-women-prosecuted-for-extramarital-sex-in-uae-finds-bbc https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/26/hundreds-of-wo...

knodi123 10y ago
> For instance, a woman getting raped is defined as "extramarital sex" which is a crime. He literally ended his comment with that point. You're not adding anything here.
- ElijahLynn 10y ago
  Literal: You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means. https://www.google.com/search?q=you+keep+using+that+word https://www.google.com/search?q=you+keep+using+that+word
  - wlesieutre 10y ago
    Except 794CD01 did literally end his comment with that point: > it would be more appropriate to focus on the things that are crimes and should not be, like their moronic VoIP laws. Anyway, I think we can all agree that throwing the book at people for bullshit crimes and the bullshit crimes themselves are both bullshit.
    - ethanbond 10y ago
      I guess some commenters with a sense of nuance don't find weird VoIP laws to be remotely similar to caveman era rape and monogamy laws and find the conflation somewhat distasteful.
      - wlesieutre 10y ago
        I admit, I don't know why ptaipale bought that up as an example of their laws, since there are plenty of electronic examples that are relevant to the VPN issue. For instance, posting vacation photos on Facebook. If you don't get permission from someone in a photo, even in a public space, it's illegal in the UAE. And if you were posting to Facebook through a VPN, stack on an extra half million dollars. That part was previously covered under this law, with the new additions being to cover VOIP and other blocked services. Regardless of the recent changes, the UAE is awfully far down on the list of places I'd ever consider traveling.
        ptaipale 10y ago
        I brought that up simply because it was the most recent, and perhaps most illustrative, example that came to my mind that shows how different ideas people have about what should be a crime.
        wlesieutre 10y ago
        Works for me, I suppose the photography thing requires more explanation. I had to google the specifics.
CodeSheikh 10y ago
It baffles me how your ignorance fuels you to connect two unrelated things, cyber crime vs sexual offenses. The problem everyone trying to discuss here is "Whether any usage of VPN" is banned in the UAE? Next time you go see a doctor for a throat rash are you going to get colonoscopy too? A good discussion here on same topic: https://www.quora.com/Is-using-a-VPN-in-the-UAE-illegal https://www.quora.com/Is-using-a-VPN-in-the-UAE-illegal UAE is not USA where anyone can use/say/do anything by anyway they like. It is a sovereign state, a monarchy. She welcomes people to live there in a very healthy and free lifestyle as long as you dont step out of your bounds. Trouble makers are going to find troubles to make even they live on an isolated island. I hope UAE govt come through and make an official elaborated statement that VPN usage for business/work related purpose is not discouraged.
- zdean 10y ago
  "She welcomes people to live there in a very healthy and free lifestyle as long as you dont step out of your bounds." I can't tell if you're being sarcastic with that statement... https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/series/modern-day-slavery-in-focus+world/united-arab-emirates https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/series/modern...
- aioprisan 10y ago
  You lost us at the "healthy and free" part, where press and media is actively censored. Don't get me started on freedom of religion. Where's the freedom in that, again?
- ptaipale 10y ago
  >connect two unrelated things, cyber crime vs sexual offenses. Are you absolutely sure they are that unrelated? Anyway, my point was that some of the things classified as "crimes" -- more explicitly, sexual offences -- in UAE are just a vile miscarriage of actual justice. Therefore, just referring to something not being a problem because it's "throwing the book at people already committing crimes" is not that good. I don't know if people misread my comment because I did not elaborate too much about the case I linked. The problem is not that a sexual offence is a crime in UAE. The problem is that when a group of men rapes a woman in UAE, it is a sexual offence committed by that woman when she makes the mistake of reporting it to authorities. I find that approach reprehensible. Yes, I know I'm applying my own Western norms to other people. When visiting places like UAE, I of course respect the local practices to avoid committing offences there, but I still do think some of their ideas of sexual offences what are backwards, reactionary and reprehensible. What you say about UAE as a sovereign state is of course quite true: She welcomes people to live there in a very healthy and free lifestyle as long as you dont step out of your bounds. The same could be said about any country, every repressive dictatorship. Life is fine as long as you don't step out of your "bounds". The "bounds" in UAE are less unreasonable than in DPRK, for instance, but I consider some of them still problematic. As such, this statement "throwing the book at people already committing crimes" is not really saying anything. The VPN rules just add to the injury of having some very, very unreasonable laws. (UAE is not USA, and I'm not from USA, either, so perhaps you are now making too many assumptions.)
794CD01 10y ago
Yes, but it's very simple and very common to use a VPN to circumvent their block on voip services, whereas I do not know of a way to use a VPN to rape someone, so I went with what I found to be the more reasonable example.

knodi123 10y ago

> For instance, a woman getting raped is defined as "extramarital sex" which is a crime. He literally ended his comment with that point. You're not adding anything here.

ElijahLynn 10y ago
Literal: You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means. https://www.google.com/search?q=you+keep+using+that+word https://www.google.com/search?q=you+keep+using+that+word
- wlesieutre 10y ago
  Except 794CD01 did literally end his comment with that point: > it would be more appropriate to focus on the things that are crimes and should not be, like their moronic VoIP laws. Anyway, I think we can all agree that throwing the book at people for bullshit crimes and the bullshit crimes themselves are both bullshit.
  - ethanbond 10y ago
    I guess some commenters with a sense of nuance don't find weird VoIP laws to be remotely similar to caveman era rape and monogamy laws and find the conflation somewhat distasteful.
    - wlesieutre 10y ago
      I admit, I don't know why ptaipale bought that up as an example of their laws, since there are plenty of electronic examples that are relevant to the VPN issue. For instance, posting vacation photos on Facebook. If you don't get permission from someone in a photo, even in a public space, it's illegal in the UAE. And if you were posting to Facebook through a VPN, stack on an extra half million dollars. That part was previously covered under this law, with the new additions being to cover VOIP and other blocked services. Regardless of the recent changes, the UAE is awfully far down on the list of places I'd ever consider traveling.
      - ptaipale 10y ago
        I brought that up simply because it was the most recent, and perhaps most illustrative, example that came to my mind that shows how different ideas people have about what should be a crime.
        wlesieutre 10y ago
        Works for me, I suppose the photography thing requires more explanation. I had to google the specifics.

CodeSheikh 10y ago

It baffles me how your ignorance fuels you to connect two unrelated things, cyber crime vs sexual offenses. The problem everyone trying to discuss here is "Whether any usage of VPN" is banned in the UAE? Next time you go see a doctor for a throat rash are you going to get colonoscopy too? A good discussion here on same topic: https://www.quora.com/Is-using-a-VPN-in-the-UAE-illegal https://www.quora.com/Is-using-a-VPN-in-the-UAE-illegal UAE is not USA where anyone can use/say/do anything by anyway they like. It is a sovereign state, a monarchy. She welcomes people to live there in a very healthy and free lifestyle as long as you dont step out of your bounds. Trouble makers are going to find troubles to make even they live on an isolated island. I hope UAE govt come through and make an official elaborated statement that VPN usage for business/work related purpose is not discouraged.

zdean 10y ago
"She welcomes people to live there in a very healthy and free lifestyle as long as you dont step out of your bounds." I can't tell if you're being sarcastic with that statement... https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/series/modern-day-slavery-in-focus+world/united-arab-emirates https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/series/modern...
aioprisan 10y ago
You lost us at the "healthy and free" part, where press and media is actively censored. Don't get me started on freedom of religion. Where's the freedom in that, again?
ptaipale 10y ago
>connect two unrelated things, cyber crime vs sexual offenses. Are you absolutely sure they are that unrelated? Anyway, my point was that some of the things classified as "crimes" -- more explicitly, sexual offences -- in UAE are just a vile miscarriage of actual justice. Therefore, just referring to something not being a problem because it's "throwing the book at people already committing crimes" is not that good. I don't know if people misread my comment because I did not elaborate too much about the case I linked. The problem is not that a sexual offence is a crime in UAE. The problem is that when a group of men rapes a woman in UAE, it is a sexual offence committed by that woman when she makes the mistake of reporting it to authorities. I find that approach reprehensible. Yes, I know I'm applying my own Western norms to other people. When visiting places like UAE, I of course respect the local practices to avoid committing offences there, but I still do think some of their ideas of sexual offences what are backwards, reactionary and reprehensible. What you say about UAE as a sovereign state is of course quite true: She welcomes people to live there in a very healthy and free lifestyle as long as you dont step out of your bounds. The same could be said about any country, every repressive dictatorship. Life is fine as long as you don't step out of your "bounds". The "bounds" in UAE are less unreasonable than in DPRK, for instance, but I consider some of them still problematic. As such, this statement "throwing the book at people already committing crimes" is not really saying anything. The VPN rules just add to the injury of having some very, very unreasonable laws. (UAE is not USA, and I'm not from USA, either, so perhaps you are now making too many assumptions.)

794CD01 10y ago

Yes, but it's very simple and very common to use a VPN to circumvent their block on voip services, whereas I do not know of a way to use a VPN to rape someone, so I went with what I found to be the more reasonable example.