5 ms·

Does this bring to mind for anyone else movements crumbling from the inside due to clever sabotage? Huey Newton come to mind? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blac

• Analemma_ 10y ago
  > I'm not saying that's what's going on here. But it comes to mind. Stop with this Fox News bullshit. If you have a theory about what's happening here, own it - enough of these "I'm not saying... " non-accusation accusations.
  • Kinnard 10y ago
    I'm actually not informed enough to make any accusations. But I can say what reading about this brings to mind.
    • VonGuard 10y ago
      Totally unrelated. The Panthers were actually taking charge of their own community to police it because the police would not. They fed the hungry and took care of the poor in their communities because people would not. The FBI then ruined them by selling them illegal guns through Richard Aoki, and arresting the people who bought the guns. Jake, on the other hand, talked at conferences and took credit for tech work. Then he raped some people. Plus, he's one dood. Sooooooo, no, no similarities at all, actually.
      • wolfgke 10y ago
        > Then he raped some people. Some people claimed that Jake raped them. Up to now it is his word against hers.
      • Kinnard 10y ago
        There was an active campaign of misinformation by the FBI to turn Panthers against each other and discredit Party members. It worked too . . . Again, I'm not arguing that's what's going on here
        • dublinben 10y ago
          >Again, I'm not arguing that's what's going on here Then why bring it up in the first place?
          • Kinnard 10y ago
            Because it came to mind and I wanted to know if it came to anyone else's mind . . . it's pertinent.
          • mr_spothawk 10y ago
            i think it's relevant to consider if this is a COINTELPRO type operation. and important, given the treatment of what's-his-face, who wound up in the Ecuadorian embassy. that said, it seems like we can dismiss the likelihood of a COINTELPRO-type operation happening right now. rather, it seems that Jake's a snake... sadly. Sad for the folks at tor who had to put up with it. Sad for all the chumps who are distracted from the importance of Tor, in favor of disputing the validity of claims about sexual harassment (or worse). maybe Applebaum is a narc?
            • VonGuard 10y ago
              Why would the DOD need a narc inside Tor, when it's the single largest funder of the project?
  • devishard 10y ago
    Okay, if you want this stated more directly: I don't know the facts around this case, and frankly, I don't particularly care: that's his business and the business of his victims. If Applebaum is a rapist, he should be in jail, if not he shouldn't. Either way, society has decided that rapists shouldn't be allowed to do good things like contribute to Tor. This means that accusing people of rape (truthfully or not) is a viable attack on projects such as Tor. There's no denying that this incentivizes actors who want to weaken Tor to accuse people such as Applebaum of rape. I think that at this point, keeping Applebaum involved in the Tor project would be bad for Tor, regardless of whether he did it or not, so conversations about whether or not he did it are rather academic. If we're going to engage in academic speculation, I do think Applebaum did it. The other members of the Tor project seem to have investigated and concluded that (admittedly it's not 100% clear), and have little reason to lie about it. However, this doesn't in any way mean that there wasn't foul play. Even if most rape accusations were true, that doesn't mean they all were, or that people came forward for altruistic reasons. We do need to come up with defenses against the attack where people accuse people of rape to damage the projects they contribute to. One such defense is to not have any players in a project feature so prominently that a hit to their reputation is a hit to the reputation of the project.
  • frabbit 10y ago
    > enough of these "I'm not saying... " non-accusation accusations. Agreed. It's a weaselly way of obfuscating one's real argument: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophasis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophasis
• 1_2__3 10y ago
  You'd have to be out of your mind or staggeringly naive to think this isn't happening. Or is it just a coincidence that the people who are big movers and shakers in areas that shake up government apparently are all rapists and evil?
  • jubalfh 10y ago
    Let me point you at one gentleman's comment left a few weeks ago on another thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11850889 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11850889.
    • Kinnard 10y ago
      Perhaps there is information to which we are not privy. Wait, there's always information to which we, humans, are not privy.