5 ms·

If it gets full Linux support, i.e. I can blow away Windows and use Ubuntu, then I'm in. This'll be my last macbook ..

xorcist 10y ago
They say nothing of Linux support, so they probably didn't care much for it. The bigger model has Nvidia graphics, and the smaller model has only 4GB RAM. For a Linux notebook, I think you'd be better off with one of the Dell or Lenovo with good support.
jonathankoren 10y ago
> If it gets full Linux support... I ran linux as my primary os for 10 years. This was never true for me. Something was always broken, or wonky. 10 years of platitudes about how "it will get better", but it didn't. There is always new hardware to support to various degrees. I got a mac, because I wanted to be able to listen to music and print at the same time. Also, I was tired of all my photos coming out pink.
- keithpeter 10y ago
  What was stopping you from listening to music and printing at the same time? Never seen that one (USB mono laser printer/bog standard mp3 tracks to play).
  - jonathankoren 10y ago
    It had something to do with device drivers not loading. It was stupidity. It was also 2003. The printer is a classic linux desktop experience. CUPS wouldn't recognize the printer, not even as generic postscript or something, or maybe it did, but wouldn't take advantage of its high resolution because binary blobs being evil or some other high horse. Either way, binary blobs figure into this. So I had to actually buy a driver and color profiles from some company in Germany that had paid a license to make a closed source driver. While I could now print at high resolution, all the photos had a pink cast, that no amount of correction could take away. Boot into Windows, thing prints fine. Ironically, the company touted its color profiles as being better Windows. In 10 years, I never had a machine that had all of it's hardware working correctly. But hey, maybe 2016 is finally the Year of Linux Desktop!
    - keithpeter 10y ago
      Best of luck with it all. 13 years is some staying power!
      - jonathankoren 10y ago
        After 10 years of linux, I got a mac 12 years ago, and never looked back. It's unix in all the ways I want, and none of the ways I don't. Sysdamining is not my favorite thing.
        fit2rule 10y ago
        I have a Linux DAW and two Linux Dev workstations that don't need much "sysadmin'ing" beyond the normal update maintenance schedule, so I dunno .. I think the beauty of Linux is that it allows for your end of the extreme, and mine, and doesn't just force everyone into a pissed-in sandbox, like OSX.
chj 10y ago
Installed Ubuntu once, I can't help to notice that it tries too much to be macosx. I would rather keep using macbook, or use plain debian instead if installing wifi driver weren't a pain in the ass.
- deno 10y ago
  Give KDE a try! https://neon.kde.org/ https://neon.kde.org/
  - cocotino 10y ago
    Plasma is as brittle as always. Years in and still is half finished. Like the developer rushed to implement the mockup so it looks good in screenshots, but then polished absolutely nothing about it.
    - deno 10y ago
      They’ve been through two technology changes, rebuilding basically from scratch every time. This (Plasma 5 and KDE Frameworks 5) feels like the final evolution stage. It’s gaining polish with every point release. Desktop search is finally quick. The UI stack (QML) is nimble and powerful. Breeze is the best looking flat design, both beautiful and clean. Even the default desktop wallpapers are gorgeous. The only thing remaining is the Akonadi legacy, which is being replaced. The rest is details. KDE is the best desktop Linux has to offer now, and it’s the best platform to build upon in the future.
      - prewett 10y ago
        If two technology changes is an excuse for unimplemented features, that sounds like some pretty unusable software to me. "The rest is details" was exactly the problem the parent was referring to. "Desktop search is finally quick"--I think most users would want it to be quick first, and then the devs can do whatever "technology changes" they want. I tried to like KDE, but every time I tried it, one of the first apps I tried would immediately crash. Plus it's default looked like a bad copy of Windows XP, which was a bad copy of the Mac, so it looked really bad. (That was a long time ago.) Unfortunately, GNOME looked nice, but had no features, so I just gave up and went to a bare window manager and realized I have no need for anything a DE offers. Then the problem became that sawfish became unsupported, and nothing else had the same customizability.
iagooar 10y ago
You will soon come back after you realize how badly broken any other combination of hardware and software is.
- pritambaral 10y ago
  > any other combination of hardware and software is The ThinkPad X250 I'm using right now with Linux would disagree. The Sony Vaio I had in 2010 and put Linux on would disagree. The Dell Inspiron I had last year would fit the description of "broken" but not "badly broken". Are there poor pairings of hardware and software outside the Apple garden? Sure. Does that mean everything outside Apple's garden is poor?
  - fit2rule 10y ago
    I concur. No true Linux user gets stumped by these things. For my part, I've had perfect, smoothly-running Linux workstations for decades now, and for me its a no-brainer to select hardware for the purpose of running Linux. Like I said, if this has decent Linux support, I'll switch from Apple in a moments' notice. Linux can do just as well, if not better, than OSX for many, many things ..
kennell 10y ago
I do see the Nvidia dual-graphics chip causing problems on Linux. They should have dropped the Nvidia chip all the way, it is a shitty compromise. Nobody is going to play games on this machine and the Intel IGP handles all other workloads just fine. Also, the 12.5 version coming with 4GB is a bit disappointing.
- fapjacks 10y ago
  If you mean the kind of Optimus thing, it's actually handled okay out of the box with recent Nvidia drivers. I had problems with it about two years ago, but recently reinstalled with LM17.3 and the Nvidia drivers it automatically installed handle the dual graphics thing just fine.
  - paines 10y ago
    Hey man, could you elaborate on that a bit or point to a tutorial? I am running Kubuntu 16 on a Skylake+950M laptop, and I can either use Intel or Nvidia but not both at the same time. There is Bumblebee, but my machine freezes on startup....
    - fapjacks 10y ago
      Hey, I'm not sure what to tell you. My Optimus functionality has been working since installing the "newest" version of the official Nvidia drivers (nvidia-352) on LM17.3. I turned it on in the BIOS and have been able to select from the "NVIDIA X Server Settings" utility ever since. I remember trying out Bumblebee on LM17 and having similar issues as you mention, and was unable to boot with Optimus enabled in the BIOS.
      - paines 10y ago
        I see, so I guess Mint has some combination of drivers (kernel + nvidia) which just work for your system. Good for you! Thanks for answering. Maybe I will take a look into LM!

They say nothing of Linux support, so they probably didn't care much for it. The bigger model has Nvidia graphics, and the smaller model has only 4GB RAM. For a Linux notebook, I think you'd be better off with one of the Dell or Lenovo with good support.

jonathankoren 10y ago

> If it gets full Linux support... I ran linux as my primary os for 10 years. This was never true for me. Something was always broken, or wonky. 10 years of platitudes about how "it will get better", but it didn't. There is always new hardware to support to various degrees. I got a mac, because I wanted to be able to listen to music and print at the same time. Also, I was tired of all my photos coming out pink.

keithpeter 10y ago
What was stopping you from listening to music and printing at the same time? Never seen that one (USB mono laser printer/bog standard mp3 tracks to play).
- jonathankoren 10y ago
  It had something to do with device drivers not loading. It was stupidity. It was also 2003. The printer is a classic linux desktop experience. CUPS wouldn't recognize the printer, not even as generic postscript or something, or maybe it did, but wouldn't take advantage of its high resolution because binary blobs being evil or some other high horse. Either way, binary blobs figure into this. So I had to actually buy a driver and color profiles from some company in Germany that had paid a license to make a closed source driver. While I could now print at high resolution, all the photos had a pink cast, that no amount of correction could take away. Boot into Windows, thing prints fine. Ironically, the company touted its color profiles as being better Windows. In 10 years, I never had a machine that had all of it's hardware working correctly. But hey, maybe 2016 is finally the Year of Linux Desktop!
  - keithpeter 10y ago
    Best of luck with it all. 13 years is some staying power!
    - jonathankoren 10y ago
      After 10 years of linux, I got a mac 12 years ago, and never looked back. It's unix in all the ways I want, and none of the ways I don't. Sysdamining is not my favorite thing.
      - fit2rule 10y ago
        I have a Linux DAW and two Linux Dev workstations that don't need much "sysadmin'ing" beyond the normal update maintenance schedule, so I dunno .. I think the beauty of Linux is that it allows for your end of the extreme, and mine, and doesn't just force everyone into a pissed-in sandbox, like OSX.

chj 10y ago

Installed Ubuntu once, I can't help to notice that it tries too much to be macosx. I would rather keep using macbook, or use plain debian instead if installing wifi driver weren't a pain in the ass.

deno 10y ago
Give KDE a try! https://neon.kde.org/ https://neon.kde.org/
- cocotino 10y ago
  Plasma is as brittle as always. Years in and still is half finished. Like the developer rushed to implement the mockup so it looks good in screenshots, but then polished absolutely nothing about it.
  - deno 10y ago
    They’ve been through two technology changes, rebuilding basically from scratch every time. This (Plasma 5 and KDE Frameworks 5) feels like the final evolution stage. It’s gaining polish with every point release. Desktop search is finally quick. The UI stack (QML) is nimble and powerful. Breeze is the best looking flat design, both beautiful and clean. Even the default desktop wallpapers are gorgeous. The only thing remaining is the Akonadi legacy, which is being replaced. The rest is details. KDE is the best desktop Linux has to offer now, and it’s the best platform to build upon in the future.
    - prewett 10y ago
      If two technology changes is an excuse for unimplemented features, that sounds like some pretty unusable software to me. "The rest is details" was exactly the problem the parent was referring to. "Desktop search is finally quick"--I think most users would want it to be quick first, and then the devs can do whatever "technology changes" they want. I tried to like KDE, but every time I tried it, one of the first apps I tried would immediately crash. Plus it's default looked like a bad copy of Windows XP, which was a bad copy of the Mac, so it looked really bad. (That was a long time ago.) Unfortunately, GNOME looked nice, but had no features, so I just gave up and went to a bare window manager and realized I have no need for anything a DE offers. Then the problem became that sawfish became unsupported, and nothing else had the same customizability.

iagooar 10y ago

You will soon come back after you realize how badly broken any other combination of hardware and software is.

pritambaral 10y ago
> any other combination of hardware and software is The ThinkPad X250 I'm using right now with Linux would disagree. The Sony Vaio I had in 2010 and put Linux on would disagree. The Dell Inspiron I had last year would fit the description of "broken" but not "badly broken". Are there poor pairings of hardware and software outside the Apple garden? Sure. Does that mean everything outside Apple's garden is poor?
- fit2rule 10y ago
  I concur. No true Linux user gets stumped by these things. For my part, I've had perfect, smoothly-running Linux workstations for decades now, and for me its a no-brainer to select hardware for the purpose of running Linux. Like I said, if this has decent Linux support, I'll switch from Apple in a moments' notice. Linux can do just as well, if not better, than OSX for many, many things ..

kennell 10y ago

I do see the Nvidia dual-graphics chip causing problems on Linux. They should have dropped the Nvidia chip all the way, it is a shitty compromise. Nobody is going to play games on this machine and the Intel IGP handles all other workloads just fine. Also, the 12.5 version coming with 4GB is a bit disappointing.

fapjacks 10y ago
If you mean the kind of Optimus thing, it's actually handled okay out of the box with recent Nvidia drivers. I had problems with it about two years ago, but recently reinstalled with LM17.3 and the Nvidia drivers it automatically installed handle the dual graphics thing just fine.
- paines 10y ago
  Hey man, could you elaborate on that a bit or point to a tutorial? I am running Kubuntu 16 on a Skylake+950M laptop, and I can either use Intel or Nvidia but not both at the same time. There is Bumblebee, but my machine freezes on startup....
  - fapjacks 10y ago
    Hey, I'm not sure what to tell you. My Optimus functionality has been working since installing the "newest" version of the official Nvidia drivers (nvidia-352) on LM17.3. I turned it on in the BIOS and have been able to select from the "NVIDIA X Server Settings" utility ever since. I remember trying out Bumblebee on LM17 and having similar issues as you mention, and was unable to boot with Optimus enabled in the BIOS.
    - paines 10y ago
      I see, so I guess Mint has some combination of drivers (kernel + nvidia) which just work for your system. Good for you! Thanks for answering. Maybe I will take a look into LM!