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The cost of owning a car (maintenance, financing, registration, license, insurance, tickets, parking, cleaning) will totally eclipse the cost of Lyft/Ubering a

The cost of owning a car (maintenance, financing, registration, license, insurance, tickets, parking, cleaning) will totally eclipse the cost of Lyft/Ubering a self-driving car, even (especially?) for the poor. We're already to the point where if your commute is less than 8 miles or so, using Uber daily is cheaper than the cost of ownership on a $30k vehicle. Just imagine what self-driving cars will do to that equation.

beachstartup 10y ago
it's a good point, but just a reminder that for most people the price for comparison would be public transit, bicycle, or scooter, not a $30k car.
- chjohasbrouck 10y ago
  I guess that's true. I'm not saying an 8-mile commute and a $30k car is where the line is either, though. That was just my situation roughly, and Uber wasn't a little less expensive, it was a LOT less expensive. Like, roughly 60% less expensive than owning the car when you factor in things like tread wear, depreciation, and the value of your time. And that's with no lease, no loan, and minimal insurance. The true line right now (where car ownership becomes more expensive than Uber) based on my experience is probably closer to an 8-mile commute and a $15k car. That line gets much lower when you add in things like financing, overpriced insurance, and leasing, which do affect a majority of the population. I should actually do a writeup about this. I have access to all my numbers on it but I've only ever done rough estimates (which were clear enough that choosing Uber/Lyft was obvious). Now I'm curious to see exactly how the costs compared.
  - seanp2k2 10y ago
    Plenty of people in the valley also commute in a brand new M4, Tesla, Porsche GT3, etc. >$70k cars used for commuting might not be the norm, but look around some BigCo parking lots....I'm sure that the average is much higher than $30k depending on the company.
safeignorance 10y ago
> We're already to the point where if your commute is less than 8 miles or so, using Uber daily is cheaper than the cost of ownership on a $30k vehicle. Just imagine what self-driving cars will do to that equation. Which brings up the question: why the hell would anyone buy a $30k vehicle for 16 miles of commuting?! You can get a perfectly reliable car that's even reasonably safe and comfortable for regional road trips @ well under $10k, without even looking for sales or deals. Until true driverless (no driver in vehicle, no insurance policy needed) happens, ownership will always be cheaper than daily taxi rides.
- sokoloff 10y ago
  I did. I bought a LEAF for around $30K (minus $10K in government cheese) for a commute that's about 18 miles RT. I did it because I wanted an electric car, and specifically a 2014 or later and there were very few 2014s for sale and those that were for sale were overpriced, IMO (in some cases, more than the net price of a new one). Our other car is indeed a sub-$10K 2005 CR-V with 180+K miles on it.

beachstartup 10y ago

it's a good point, but just a reminder that for most people the price for comparison would be public transit, bicycle, or scooter, not a $30k car.

chjohasbrouck 10y ago
I guess that's true. I'm not saying an 8-mile commute and a $30k car is where the line is either, though. That was just my situation roughly, and Uber wasn't a little less expensive, it was a LOT less expensive. Like, roughly 60% less expensive than owning the car when you factor in things like tread wear, depreciation, and the value of your time. And that's with no lease, no loan, and minimal insurance. The true line right now (where car ownership becomes more expensive than Uber) based on my experience is probably closer to an 8-mile commute and a $15k car. That line gets much lower when you add in things like financing, overpriced insurance, and leasing, which do affect a majority of the population. I should actually do a writeup about this. I have access to all my numbers on it but I've only ever done rough estimates (which were clear enough that choosing Uber/Lyft was obvious). Now I'm curious to see exactly how the costs compared.
- seanp2k2 10y ago
  Plenty of people in the valley also commute in a brand new M4, Tesla, Porsche GT3, etc. >$70k cars used for commuting might not be the norm, but look around some BigCo parking lots....I'm sure that the average is much higher than $30k depending on the company.

safeignorance 10y ago

> We're already to the point where if your commute is less than 8 miles or so, using Uber daily is cheaper than the cost of ownership on a $30k vehicle. Just imagine what self-driving cars will do to that equation. Which brings up the question: why the hell would anyone buy a $30k vehicle for 16 miles of commuting?! You can get a perfectly reliable car that's even reasonably safe and comfortable for regional road trips @ well under $10k, without even looking for sales or deals. Until true driverless (no driver in vehicle, no insurance policy needed) happens, ownership will always be cheaper than daily taxi rides.

sokoloff 10y ago
I did. I bought a LEAF for around $30K (minus $10K in government cheese) for a commute that's about 18 miles RT. I did it because I wanted an electric car, and specifically a 2014 or later and there were very few 2014s for sale and those that were for sale were overpriced, IMO (in some cases, more than the net price of a new one). Our other car is indeed a sub-$10K 2005 CR-V with 180+K miles on it.