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How does that explain INFORMS for Operations Research? WWII was the catalyst for a lot of technical research. It spawned the birth of the modern computer with

How does that explain INFORMS for Operations Research? WWII was the catalyst for a lot of technical research. It spawned the birth of the modern computer with Turing and it also saw the birth or what is now considered modern Operations Research. For example, during WWII George Dantzig (the person that developed the Simplex Algorithm) served in the U.S. Air Force Office of Statistical Control. He only returned to finish his PhD at Berkeley after the was was over. Also a lot of work with Bayesian search started developing around this time to do things like help search for enemy subs. However INFORMS is very involved in the OR/MS community and multiple times per year they host meetings where one of the goals is to connect grad students with companies.

dalke 10y ago
ACM and IEEE Computer Society also host meetings "where one of the goals is to connect grad students with companies." When I was in school, the local ACM chapter had meetings which which even helped undergraduates find internships and jobs. All of the major ACM conferences have a job fair. Most of the minor ones as well. > "What is it about applying the same techniques to tech that makes them special" There is nothing special about tech. The same is true for most fields. Where is your central source where you can hire a chemist? Usually, the potential chemist hire comes to the site, talks to people, gives a job talk, etc. > "say they HAVE to give these multi-day long technical screens" The link you gave to AirBNB says it's one day technical screen, and candidates which pass that screen have a followup with four non-tech interviews. It is not a "multi-day long technical screen".
- PaulHoule 10y ago
  The problem is not that students have a hard time finding entry level jobs. The problem is that computing careers tend to be dead end jobs in the long term. Like seriously, you get hired into Google and where are you going to go? Become a product manager? Really? Academics get to look like they are doing positive when they are running something just as exploitative as the Thoroughbred racing industry. Job fairs are also as much as a part of the problem as they are part of the solution. For instance, Google and Facebook are far more likely to send recruiters to the moon than they are to send them to a historically black college.
  - dalke 10y ago
    When you say "the problem", do you mean the OP's problem? Or the problem you have with the ACM or IEEE? Or the problem with CS as a career? Because I thought we were talking about the OP's problem. You know, people can have an entirely good life without having to climb a career ladder. Going back a tech-generation, and thinking of a friend, after you work at NeXT and AutoCAD, you go to a small plastics manufacturing company and with team of two others, manage their IT systems. It pays well, has good benefits, is 10 minutes commute, has diverse challenges, and he loves that they make actual physical things. What's wrong with that? Also, http://www.csmonitor.com/Technology/2015/0505/Google-sends-its-engineers-back-to-university http://www.csmonitor.com/Technology/2015/0505/Google-sends-i... : "In an effort to assist in Silicon Valley's diversity problem, Google has sent some of its engineers to historically black colleges to shake up the system." As far as I know, Google has not yet sent anyone to the Moon.
- o_safadinho 10y ago
  I guess the problem comes that especially outside of tech, they don't have independent technical screens, the company reads your paper. If we stick with AirBnB here is a posting they made with the AEA (https://www.aeaweb.org/joe/listing.php?JOE_ID=2015-02_111454432&issue=2015-02&keyword_search=&section=5&jel=all&country=all&recent_only=Show+all+listings+published+since+August+1%2C+2015&from=1970-01-01&to=1970-01-01&listings_order_by=institution_a&lpp=50 https://www.aeaweb.org/joe/listing.php?JOE_ID=2015-02_111454...). All of the interviewing takes place at the AEA meeting and the candidate is expecting to have their Job Market paper (a completed technical project that is used for presenting at all of your interviews). The American Statistical Association has something similar with their Joint Statistical Meeting (https://www.amstat.org/meetings/jsm/2016/employerlist.cfm https://www.amstat.org/meetings/jsm/2016/employerlist.cfm). Once I finish grad school I wouldn't do any type of homework for a job interview. If you can't read one of my papers then I just wouldn't be interested.
  - dalke 10y ago
    The job process of hiring a new chemist is more than just reading your papers. And yes, papers, as most people will have published several papers in the process of getting a PhD. There are references to check up on. There's the ability to present your job talk; the ability to present is an important skill when you work in a company. Some candidates during the interview day might yell at a secretary or send text messages while being interviewed - these are two no-go indicators for most jobs. Those two examples come from a comment at http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2014/11/03/job_interview_advice http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2014/11/03/job... . Another points out a technical screening question one might ask a chemist: > If I ask a PhD candidate how many protecting groups they know for nitrogen and they can name ten off the top of their head with pros and cons for each – then that tells me something. If all they can come up with is “Ummmm… Boc?” – well that tells me something too. http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2006/01/29/name_reactions_for_one_thousand_alex http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2006/01/29/nam... suggests: > I think I might work up some questions like that for the next time I interview someone. “Here,” I’ll say, handing over a sheet of paper. “SciFinder says that you can do this reaction any of these six ways. Which one would you recommend trying first, and why?” A recent grad comments about a job interview, with questions "more along the lines of “do you know some basic transformations and how they occur?” Given that evidence that there are technical screens for chemists, why do you write fields "especially outside of tech ... don't have independent technical screens", and that interviewers only look at one's single paper publication? You write: "If we stick with AirBnB". If we stick with AirBNB then re-read the interview process you linked to earlier. Not only does it not do multiple days of technical screening, as you thought, but it says nothing about a homework assignment; which seems to be a particular point of irritation for you. You appear to have an incorrect interpretation of what you read, and an incorrect interpretation of what happens in other fields. I suggest that means you may need to re-evaluate what you think you know of the topic.

dalke 10y ago

ACM and IEEE Computer Society also host meetings "where one of the goals is to connect grad students with companies." When I was in school, the local ACM chapter had meetings which which even helped undergraduates find internships and jobs. All of the major ACM conferences have a job fair. Most of the minor ones as well. > "What is it about applying the same techniques to tech that makes them special" There is nothing special about tech. The same is true for most fields. Where is your central source where you can hire a chemist? Usually, the potential chemist hire comes to the site, talks to people, gives a job talk, etc. > "say they HAVE to give these multi-day long technical screens" The link you gave to AirBNB says it's one day technical screen, and candidates which pass that screen have a followup with four non-tech interviews. It is not a "multi-day long technical screen".

PaulHoule 10y ago
The problem is not that students have a hard time finding entry level jobs. The problem is that computing careers tend to be dead end jobs in the long term. Like seriously, you get hired into Google and where are you going to go? Become a product manager? Really? Academics get to look like they are doing positive when they are running something just as exploitative as the Thoroughbred racing industry. Job fairs are also as much as a part of the problem as they are part of the solution. For instance, Google and Facebook are far more likely to send recruiters to the moon than they are to send them to a historically black college.
- dalke 10y ago
  When you say "the problem", do you mean the OP's problem? Or the problem you have with the ACM or IEEE? Or the problem with CS as a career? Because I thought we were talking about the OP's problem. You know, people can have an entirely good life without having to climb a career ladder. Going back a tech-generation, and thinking of a friend, after you work at NeXT and AutoCAD, you go to a small plastics manufacturing company and with team of two others, manage their IT systems. It pays well, has good benefits, is 10 minutes commute, has diverse challenges, and he loves that they make actual physical things. What's wrong with that? Also, http://www.csmonitor.com/Technology/2015/0505/Google-sends-its-engineers-back-to-university http://www.csmonitor.com/Technology/2015/0505/Google-sends-i... : "In an effort to assist in Silicon Valley's diversity problem, Google has sent some of its engineers to historically black colleges to shake up the system." As far as I know, Google has not yet sent anyone to the Moon.
o_safadinho 10y ago
I guess the problem comes that especially outside of tech, they don't have independent technical screens, the company reads your paper. If we stick with AirBnB here is a posting they made with the AEA (https://www.aeaweb.org/joe/listing.php?JOE_ID=2015-02_111454432&issue=2015-02&keyword_search=&section=5&jel=all&country=all&recent_only=Show+all+listings+published+since+August+1%2C+2015&from=1970-01-01&to=1970-01-01&listings_order_by=institution_a&lpp=50 https://www.aeaweb.org/joe/listing.php?JOE_ID=2015-02_111454...). All of the interviewing takes place at the AEA meeting and the candidate is expecting to have their Job Market paper (a completed technical project that is used for presenting at all of your interviews). The American Statistical Association has something similar with their Joint Statistical Meeting (https://www.amstat.org/meetings/jsm/2016/employerlist.cfm https://www.amstat.org/meetings/jsm/2016/employerlist.cfm). Once I finish grad school I wouldn't do any type of homework for a job interview. If you can't read one of my papers then I just wouldn't be interested.
- dalke 10y ago
  The job process of hiring a new chemist is more than just reading your papers. And yes, papers, as most people will have published several papers in the process of getting a PhD. There are references to check up on. There's the ability to present your job talk; the ability to present is an important skill when you work in a company. Some candidates during the interview day might yell at a secretary or send text messages while being interviewed - these are two no-go indicators for most jobs. Those two examples come from a comment at http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2014/11/03/job_interview_advice http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2014/11/03/job... . Another points out a technical screening question one might ask a chemist: > If I ask a PhD candidate how many protecting groups they know for nitrogen and they can name ten off the top of their head with pros and cons for each – then that tells me something. If all they can come up with is “Ummmm… Boc?” – well that tells me something too. http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2006/01/29/name_reactions_for_one_thousand_alex http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2006/01/29/nam... suggests: > I think I might work up some questions like that for the next time I interview someone. “Here,” I’ll say, handing over a sheet of paper. “SciFinder says that you can do this reaction any of these six ways. Which one would you recommend trying first, and why?” A recent grad comments about a job interview, with questions "more along the lines of “do you know some basic transformations and how they occur?” Given that evidence that there are technical screens for chemists, why do you write fields "especially outside of tech ... don't have independent technical screens", and that interviewers only look at one's single paper publication? You write: "If we stick with AirBnB". If we stick with AirBNB then re-read the interview process you linked to earlier. Not only does it not do multiple days of technical screening, as you thought, but it says nothing about a homework assignment; which seems to be a particular point of irritation for you. You appear to have an incorrect interpretation of what you read, and an incorrect interpretation of what happens in other fields. I suggest that means you may need to re-evaluate what you think you know of the topic.