32 ms·

Ember.js 2.7 and 2.8 beta released

170 points by andruby 10y ago

jjawssd 10y ago
Why does Ember matter?
- reinhardt1053 10y ago
  The cool kids have jumped to other frameworks, but you would be surprised to know how many people are using it in production http://emberjs.com/ember-users/ http://emberjs.com/ember-users/ That said, if (Something is on the frontpage) { it matters for some users of the HN community. }
- awesomepeter 10y ago
  Why wouldn't it matter? It's an actively developed framework which many people really like. I'm actually baffled that it doesn't get mentioned more often.
  - okket 10y ago
    A fair amount of posts on HN deal with the negative sides of things, so it could be a good sign that Ember does not get mentioned more often while growing >)
- yeano 10y ago
  Yea..the biggest problem with Ember is an individuals ego,as if we care that he's a core committer on the projects he is. Gmafb
  - machty 10y ago
    I haven't been on the core team in months
    - briantmaurer 10y ago
      Might want to update your HN profile ;)
- gedy 10y ago
  It's one of the few framework options for an opinionated framework that has easy to use setup and tools for generating views, models, etc. Not every company or team has the time or interest to fiddle around with tweaking their setup and codebase for new JS UI projects.
- eibrahim 10y ago
  I have been writing software for over 17 years and I did Angular for 2+ years before switching to ember. In the last 17 years, I have never been happier and more productive than I am today with ember. It does bother me that it is not as popular as it deserves. I don't want to self promote but I am sure you can find my other posts, I am creating a web app once every 2 or 3 weeks with ember and firebase - the beauty of conventions over configurations and of opinionated frameworks. There 50 ways to setup a react or angular project. There is ONE way to do it in ember. You can move into a new code base and know exactly where everything is. (ps: you could change the conventions if you wanted, but why would you do that!!!)
jjawssd 10y ago
How does Ember fit into today's web ecosystem especially as it relates to React?
- erikrothoff 10y ago
  Ember is moving to a similar view model as React (though still having templates separated from logic) but isolated components with immutable state being passed down. React has a really vibrant ecosystems with lots of batteries to choose from, whereas Ember comes with batteries included. For example routing, test runners, controller/view logic concerns. Ember also has an optional data package called ember-data, with the goal of being the defacto way of dealing with server side state. It's fairly opinionated, but swappable with other alternatives.
erikrothoff 10y ago
I remember seeing the blog post about Ember 2.0 being released around this time 1 year ago. Previously I was edging towards React and the built tools du jour. I started a new job which needed a rewritten frontend, so I went with Ember and am super happy. The CLI tools are fantastic, and coming from Rails the integrated test suite, generators and opinionated framework is such a breeze. I am super excited about what the future holds, and having a community working together on one project and goal is amazing. Even though they don't have a huge commercial backing, a lot of medium-large companies are using Ember and improving the ecosystem. The core team are really smart people, and I am amazed at the smart stuff they build, yet how they have found a way of working to iterate so fast.
- orf 10y ago
  I'm in the same boat, it's one of the only tools I feel almost fanatical about sharing and spreading. It's really nice and it's a shame it doesn't get more love on HN. The only downside is it takes a while to get your head around its object model and how to structure your apps in terms of computed properties and observers. Once that clicks though your in a nirvana of productiveness, and having toyed with the react ecosystem I've got to say that Embers learning curve is a lot nicer. There is Glimmer 2 comming out soonish, fast boot taking off and the Ember engines RFC implemented in the next version. Things are looking good!
  - k__ 10y ago
    > it's a shame it doesn't get more love on HN Probably because it feels a bit like "the old way" for many. A big framework that covers all and brings its own tooling. Today, everyone uses its own stack to build. WebPack, Browserify, Rollup, tsc, Gulp, Make etc. When I was using Ember, I used it with Gulp, Emblem, LiveScript etc. Then they pulled this Ember-CLI stuff and some modules told me, that they depend on it. Suddendly I had to learn a new tool and tell it to do my bidding or else I couldn't use Ember add ons (painlessly). I don't think it's a inherently bad idea, especially for a Framework as old as Ember, which reinvents itself constantly.
    - 10y ago
Longwelwind 10y ago
Over-reliance on strings is a pattern that I've seen a lot in the Javascript environment. For example: var arr = [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }, { value: 'b' }]; arr.uniqBy('value'); // [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }] Wouldn't be better to do something like this ? var arr = [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }, { value: 'b' }]; arr.uniqBy(element => element.value); // [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }] You have to write a little bit more (I could have used "e" instead of "element", though) but if you do a typo in the name of the property, it can be caught by a linter/compiler, and you don't get the feeling you're relying on Vodoo magic. Are there any advantages to use a string instead of a "static" way of accessing the property ?
- topaxi 10y ago
  The xxBy methods are just for convenience, usually you can provide your own function for each method. Example: Ember.computed.map('myArray', function() { return foo.bar; }) vs. Ember.computed.mapBy('myArray', 'bar') What you are asking for, would need a change to Ember.computed.uniq, allowing it to accept a custom function.
- cnlevy 10y ago
  See http://devdocs.io/lodash~4/index#uniqBy http://devdocs.io/lodash~4/index#uniqBy
- orf 10y ago
  EmberJS uses strings as property paths. You can use 'foo.bar.firstObject.baz' as a unique key the same as any other function that takes a property paths (like a computed property). In Ember you write a lot of these so any small overhead like a lambda is a bit of a waste. Also I don't think ember would work with functions instead of strings, the whole point of the strings is that the unique function is only called when one of the items in the property paths changes, and you can't get that from functions. You can only evaluate them.
  - Longwelwind 10y ago
    Thanks, I didn't know that Ember did more than just fetching the value. About time wasted, I feel like in the long run, you gain more time by writing statically analyzable code. If you make a typo in the string, you would have to build/transpile+launch the code in order to see the error. Additionaly, if you ever refactor the name of the property, the linter will directly tell you that "value" in the lambda must be changed.
nagarjun 10y ago
I am really excited to see Engines getting some more recognition in this release. We are building https://tripcloud.io/ https://tripcloud.io/ entirely with Ember and the application is starting to get bigger and bigger. We have been waiting to see it stabilize a little so we can adopt it. Can we safely use it in production now?
- dgeb 10y ago
  Developers from several large public-facing sites have already told me that they're using engines in production. In fact, Kacey Coughlin is giving a talk tonight at the SF Ember meetup about LinkedIn's experience using engines [1]. Granted, the talk is titled "On the Bleeding Edge with Ember Engines", which fairly points out that there are some rough edges left to smooth over. Still, I think it's a pretty good time to start exploring engines. I'd say that the feature should be quite stable by the time 2.8 stable ships. Plus, we should have a preliminary lazy-loading story finished by then, which has the potential to really impact your app's perceived performance. [1] - http://www.meetup.com/Ember-SF/events/231368426/ http://www.meetup.com/Ember-SF/events/231368426/
geekodour 10y ago
This will be awesome
esistgut 10y ago
Does Ember offer something similar to React Native for React or NativeScript for Angular 2?
- mrinterweb 10y ago
  I don't believe so. My opinion is that well optimized hybrid apps can often compete with the quality of native apps. It is not easy crafting a good hybrid app, and few good ones exist. Many of the low quality hybrid apps have given hybrid apps a bad reputation. Ember + cordova can be a good toolset for creating good hybrid apps.
  - dbbk 10y ago
    Which one is it? "Hybrid apps can often compete", or "few good ones exist"?
    - mrinterweb 10y ago
      LOL. I can see how that could be confusing. In theory a hybrid app could compete, if it was written well; yet, there are plenty of bad hybrid apps that give hybrid apps a bad name. I think it is a matter of effort that developers are willing to put into making a hybrid app. With a hybrid app, having good UI design is more of a challenge because they can not always leverage OS UI components, and when they try to mimic OS UI components, they never look quite right. With custom UI design, many users may never know if they are using a hybrid app or native. Obviously, hybrid apps are not an option for all types of apps, but I'd argue that hybrid is a viable option for many if not most types of apps. So long as the performance of the hybrid app is not noticeably slow to the end user, hybrid apps can be great apps.
- wldcordeiro 10y ago
  I saw that there is a an Ember addon to work with Electron[0], that's probably the closest thing I can think of. [0] - https://github.com/felixrieseberg/ember-electron https://github.com/felixrieseberg/ember-electron
co_dh 10y ago
I used Ember once, took over an Ember project from a very good Ember programmer. I found I have to duplicate the models from database, to ORM in backend, and Ember. Everytime I have to modify/add a database column, I have to modify 3 places. So I end up get ride of Ember and use Flask-Admin only. Even better, I get ride of the ORM in Flask too, using reflection. Then my code is 3 times less, and I feel happy.
- ben336 10y ago
  if your project was capable of running as just a series of backend driven pages, Ember probably wasn't the right choice to start with. That isn't really what it is for.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

170 points by andruby 10y ago

jjawssd 10y ago

Why does Ember matter?

reinhardt1053 10y ago
The cool kids have jumped to other frameworks, but you would be surprised to know how many people are using it in production http://emberjs.com/ember-users/ http://emberjs.com/ember-users/ That said, if (Something is on the frontpage) { it matters for some users of the HN community. }
awesomepeter 10y ago
Why wouldn't it matter? It's an actively developed framework which many people really like. I'm actually baffled that it doesn't get mentioned more often.
- okket 10y ago
  A fair amount of posts on HN deal with the negative sides of things, so it could be a good sign that Ember does not get mentioned more often while growing >)
yeano 10y ago
Yea..the biggest problem with Ember is an individuals ego,as if we care that he's a core committer on the projects he is. Gmafb
- machty 10y ago
  I haven't been on the core team in months
  - briantmaurer 10y ago
    Might want to update your HN profile ;)
gedy 10y ago
It's one of the few framework options for an opinionated framework that has easy to use setup and tools for generating views, models, etc. Not every company or team has the time or interest to fiddle around with tweaking their setup and codebase for new JS UI projects.
eibrahim 10y ago
I have been writing software for over 17 years and I did Angular for 2+ years before switching to ember. In the last 17 years, I have never been happier and more productive than I am today with ember. It does bother me that it is not as popular as it deserves. I don't want to self promote but I am sure you can find my other posts, I am creating a web app once every 2 or 3 weeks with ember and firebase - the beauty of conventions over configurations and of opinionated frameworks. There 50 ways to setup a react or angular project. There is ONE way to do it in ember. You can move into a new code base and know exactly where everything is. (ps: you could change the conventions if you wanted, but why would you do that!!!)

jjawssd 10y ago

How does Ember fit into today's web ecosystem especially as it relates to React?

erikrothoff 10y ago
Ember is moving to a similar view model as React (though still having templates separated from logic) but isolated components with immutable state being passed down. React has a really vibrant ecosystems with lots of batteries to choose from, whereas Ember comes with batteries included. For example routing, test runners, controller/view logic concerns. Ember also has an optional data package called ember-data, with the goal of being the defacto way of dealing with server side state. It's fairly opinionated, but swappable with other alternatives.

erikrothoff 10y ago

I remember seeing the blog post about Ember 2.0 being released around this time 1 year ago. Previously I was edging towards React and the built tools du jour. I started a new job which needed a rewritten frontend, so I went with Ember and am super happy. The CLI tools are fantastic, and coming from Rails the integrated test suite, generators and opinionated framework is such a breeze. I am super excited about what the future holds, and having a community working together on one project and goal is amazing. Even though they don't have a huge commercial backing, a lot of medium-large companies are using Ember and improving the ecosystem. The core team are really smart people, and I am amazed at the smart stuff they build, yet how they have found a way of working to iterate so fast.

orf 10y ago
I'm in the same boat, it's one of the only tools I feel almost fanatical about sharing and spreading. It's really nice and it's a shame it doesn't get more love on HN. The only downside is it takes a while to get your head around its object model and how to structure your apps in terms of computed properties and observers. Once that clicks though your in a nirvana of productiveness, and having toyed with the react ecosystem I've got to say that Embers learning curve is a lot nicer. There is Glimmer 2 comming out soonish, fast boot taking off and the Ember engines RFC implemented in the next version. Things are looking good!
- k__ 10y ago
  > it's a shame it doesn't get more love on HN Probably because it feels a bit like "the old way" for many. A big framework that covers all and brings its own tooling. Today, everyone uses its own stack to build. WebPack, Browserify, Rollup, tsc, Gulp, Make etc. When I was using Ember, I used it with Gulp, Emblem, LiveScript etc. Then they pulled this Ember-CLI stuff and some modules told me, that they depend on it. Suddendly I had to learn a new tool and tell it to do my bidding or else I couldn't use Ember add ons (painlessly). I don't think it's a inherently bad idea, especially for a Framework as old as Ember, which reinvents itself constantly.
  - 10y ago

Longwelwind 10y ago

Over-reliance on strings is a pattern that I've seen a lot in the Javascript environment. For example: var arr = [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }, { value: 'b' }]; arr.uniqBy('value'); // [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }] Wouldn't be better to do something like this ? var arr = [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }, { value: 'b' }]; arr.uniqBy(element => element.value); // [{ value: 'a' }, { value: 'b' }] You have to write a little bit more (I could have used "e" instead of "element", though) but if you do a typo in the name of the property, it can be caught by a linter/compiler, and you don't get the feeling you're relying on Vodoo magic. Are there any advantages to use a string instead of a "static" way of accessing the property ?

topaxi 10y ago
The xxBy methods are just for convenience, usually you can provide your own function for each method. Example: Ember.computed.map('myArray', function() { return foo.bar; }) vs. Ember.computed.mapBy('myArray', 'bar') What you are asking for, would need a change to Ember.computed.uniq, allowing it to accept a custom function.
cnlevy 10y ago
See http://devdocs.io/lodash~4/index#uniqBy http://devdocs.io/lodash~4/index#uniqBy
orf 10y ago
EmberJS uses strings as property paths. You can use 'foo.bar.firstObject.baz' as a unique key the same as any other function that takes a property paths (like a computed property). In Ember you write a lot of these so any small overhead like a lambda is a bit of a waste. Also I don't think ember would work with functions instead of strings, the whole point of the strings is that the unique function is only called when one of the items in the property paths changes, and you can't get that from functions. You can only evaluate them.
- Longwelwind 10y ago
  Thanks, I didn't know that Ember did more than just fetching the value. About time wasted, I feel like in the long run, you gain more time by writing statically analyzable code. If you make a typo in the string, you would have to build/transpile+launch the code in order to see the error. Additionaly, if you ever refactor the name of the property, the linter will directly tell you that "value" in the lambda must be changed.

nagarjun 10y ago

I am really excited to see Engines getting some more recognition in this release. We are building https://tripcloud.io/ https://tripcloud.io/ entirely with Ember and the application is starting to get bigger and bigger. We have been waiting to see it stabilize a little so we can adopt it. Can we safely use it in production now?

dgeb 10y ago
Developers from several large public-facing sites have already told me that they're using engines in production. In fact, Kacey Coughlin is giving a talk tonight at the SF Ember meetup about LinkedIn's experience using engines [1]. Granted, the talk is titled "On the Bleeding Edge with Ember Engines", which fairly points out that there are some rough edges left to smooth over. Still, I think it's a pretty good time to start exploring engines. I'd say that the feature should be quite stable by the time 2.8 stable ships. Plus, we should have a preliminary lazy-loading story finished by then, which has the potential to really impact your app's perceived performance. [1] - http://www.meetup.com/Ember-SF/events/231368426/ http://www.meetup.com/Ember-SF/events/231368426/

geekodour 10y ago

This will be awesome

esistgut 10y ago

Does Ember offer something similar to React Native for React or NativeScript for Angular 2?

mrinterweb 10y ago
I don't believe so. My opinion is that well optimized hybrid apps can often compete with the quality of native apps. It is not easy crafting a good hybrid app, and few good ones exist. Many of the low quality hybrid apps have given hybrid apps a bad reputation. Ember + cordova can be a good toolset for creating good hybrid apps.
- dbbk 10y ago
  Which one is it? "Hybrid apps can often compete", or "few good ones exist"?
  - mrinterweb 10y ago
    LOL. I can see how that could be confusing. In theory a hybrid app could compete, if it was written well; yet, there are plenty of bad hybrid apps that give hybrid apps a bad name. I think it is a matter of effort that developers are willing to put into making a hybrid app. With a hybrid app, having good UI design is more of a challenge because they can not always leverage OS UI components, and when they try to mimic OS UI components, they never look quite right. With custom UI design, many users may never know if they are using a hybrid app or native. Obviously, hybrid apps are not an option for all types of apps, but I'd argue that hybrid is a viable option for many if not most types of apps. So long as the performance of the hybrid app is not noticeably slow to the end user, hybrid apps can be great apps.
wldcordeiro 10y ago
I saw that there is a an Ember addon to work with Electron[0], that's probably the closest thing I can think of. [0] - https://github.com/felixrieseberg/ember-electron https://github.com/felixrieseberg/ember-electron

co_dh 10y ago

I used Ember once, took over an Ember project from a very good Ember programmer. I found I have to duplicate the models from database, to ORM in backend, and Ember. Everytime I have to modify/add a database column, I have to modify 3 places. So I end up get ride of Ember and use Flask-Admin only. Even better, I get ride of the ORM in Flask too, using reflection. Then my code is 3 times less, and I feel happy.

ben336 10y ago
if your project was capable of running as just a series of backend driven pages, Ember probably wasn't the right choice to start with. That isn't really what it is for.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]