7 ms·

Shots Fired at Munich Shopping Centre

32 points by k-mcgrady 10y ago

Aelinsaar 10y ago
The police in Munich are now saying that at least several have been killed and injured. Sky News saying that police report multiple shooters, with none in custody.
aerovistae 10y ago
Really alarming that this is starting to happen on an almost weekly basis. So sad to me, violence from another part of the world spilling into Western Europe, an area that's finally settled into stable and peaceful democracy after millennia of war.
- Aelinsaar 10y ago
  Not to mention that this is certainly going to play into the hands of nativist and xenophobic elements in those regions, regardless of whether or not perpetrators turn out to be homegrown or not.
  - k-mcgrady 10y ago
    That's the part that's most alarming to me. The incidents are tragic but the long term consequences will also be bad. Xenophobia is getting much too common and a lot of people are pretty open about it now. Brexit hasn't helped that and if further countries follow suit it's only creating more divisions. Every attack like this (although we don't know anything about the perpetrators in this incident yet it's pretty safe to assume) just gives more fuel to the xenophobia in our society.
    - Aelinsaar 10y ago
      Exactly, and ironically terrorists of all stripes seem to be converging on a mutually xenophobic, isolationist ideology. It is unfortunately the real face of that awful phrase from the W. Bush era, "letting the terrorists win". Or at least, letting them experience something like efficacy in their fundamental goals. That should worry us more than it seems to, I think.
    - DominikR 10y ago
      Xenophobia is an _irrational_ fear. It is obviously not irrational to fear this uncontrolled immigration as there are enough fanatics among them that go on a killing spree. Two years ago stuff like this happened rarely, now it is happening regularly. And lets not even get started on the rise in sexual assaults.
- xutopia 10y ago
  Pretty nice to see that it is still in the news... pretty soon I fear it won't even be newsworthy.
  - jessriedel 10y ago
    Seeing as that terrorism is one of the few problems that would literally go away if we ignored it, I hope news readers do become bored with it.
    - DominikR 10y ago
      I wonder how anyone could believe that. In the Middle East they experienced terrorism for decades and it gets only worse.
      - jessriedel 10y ago
        They have news in the Middle East.
        dogma1138 10y ago
        Yes busses blow up in Israel, markets blow up in Iraq, and schools get blown up in Syria because of news papers.
    - eanzenberg 10y ago
      This isn't fantasy land where you can wish something go away by believing it doesn't exist. You may not value innocent life or freedom but there's plenty of us who do.
      - undersuit 10y ago
        I can value innocent life and freedoms without it being blasted on my media 24/7. The media is biased anyways, my country, the United States, has apparently killed 73 civilians in one Syrian village, Tokkhar, and HN doesn't even have coverage. Media coverage does not help the victims, it glorifies the attackers.
- zhengiszen 10y ago
  I think you're mistaken. It is European violence and its greed that began this cycle and we are "lucky" to witness decades of injustice...
- kyriakos 10y ago
  there is still no word if this is an act of terrorism or some deranged person with a weapon.
  - DominikR 10y ago
    This is terrorism, police said that multiple shooters are at large. link (sorry, German): http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/muenchen-schuesse-in-olympia-einkaufszentrum-a-1104387.html http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/muenchen-schuesse-in-o...
  - tazb 10y ago
    Are those not the samething? I'm sure a terrorist is also a deranged person
    - dogma1138 10y ago
      Yes, but terrorism has a political goal, some one who's simply insane doesn't.
k-mcgrady 10y ago
Facebook have activated their 'Safety Check' feature: https://www.facebook.com/safetycheck/munich-germany-shooting-jul22-2016/ https://www.facebook.com/safetycheck/munich-germany-shooting...
kyriakos 10y ago
live updates from reddit: https://www.reddit.com/live/xatezzbcvxxy https://www.reddit.com/live/xatezzbcvxxy
DominikR 10y ago
This is now close to where I live and the worst part is that this seems to happen now regularly. Merkel is a traitor.
- mh-cx 10y ago
  At least you have found an opportunity for your political agitation.
  - DominikR 10y ago
    As if I would hope for terror attacks near me every week! I didn't care in the slightest about Merkel and German politics before the rapes in Cologne! (I have a successful business, I'm the last one that is unhappy with his situation and wants changes) But now this is my problem, doesn't matter if I want to get involved or not. If we want this to stop we must get rid of Merkel and the refugees.
    - mh-cx 10y ago
      > ... and the refugees We have no Information so far. But you seem to have better sources, that confirm, that each and every refugee is a terrorist. So what do you suggest? [deleted] Sorry, but stereotypes like this really make me sick. You abuse a horrible crime committed by a few to judge over thousands of innocent. EDIT: Removed some too cynical phrase.
  - elgabogringo 10y ago
    The political agitators are the people doing the killing, not the person complaining about it.
    - mh-cx 10y ago
      He was not complaining about the killing but about Merkel and the refugee situation. Both are quite unrelated to the shooting. Another disgusting case of short sighted populism.
k-mcgrady 10y ago
Flagged into oblivion within 20mins. I was hoping people would choose the 'hide' option instead of flag but no they chose to kill a discussion for other people they don't want to part of anyway.
- eanzenberg 10y ago
  Censorship because a biased group's worldview is challenged.
- gonvaled 10y ago
  https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12099576 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12099576
  - k-mcgrady 10y ago
    Good post, that's the impression I get.
  - dang 10y ago
    I'd caution against drawing general conclusions about HN from spot observations about what does/doesn't get flagged. People usually fall prey to cognitive biases when they do so, e.g. thinking that the community is against them somehow. We're all primed to feel that way; the feeling just hops to different things depending on our different identities. Occam suggests you needn't look for "Anglo bias" as an explanation for why a story gets flagged when the thread includes "We must get rid of Merkel and the refugees" followed by "What do you suggest, gas chambers?" (Not that there isn't inevitably going to be something like "anglo bias" on an English-language website. But FWIW the moderators here are acutely aware of, and grateful for, and interested in, the international aspects of the community—definitely including the German ones.)
- dang 10y ago
  The discussion isn't killed; you just posted in it. The issue is what should or shouldn't be on the front page. Users manage most of that; for example, this story fell in rank because they flagged it. Moderators manage some of it too. To look at this meaningfully, you need to take two things into account. First, front page slots are the scarcest resource HN has. Second, HN is a fragile place: the stories we most want here are weaker in many ways (e.g. less agitating) than more sensational material, and also quite a bit rarer. There need to be barriers to the latter or it would flood the site.
zymhan 10y ago
News alert from the Washington Post says at least two dead :/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/german-police-seal-off-mall-area-in-munich-after-shots-fired/2016/07/22/6567e6d8-502c-11e6-a422-83ab49ed5e6a_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/german-police-seal-off-...

32 points by k-mcgrady 10y ago

The police in Munich are now saying that at least several have been killed and injured. Sky News saying that police report multiple shooters, with none in custody.

aerovistae 10y ago

Really alarming that this is starting to happen on an almost weekly basis. So sad to me, violence from another part of the world spilling into Western Europe, an area that's finally settled into stable and peaceful democracy after millennia of war.

Aelinsaar 10y ago
Not to mention that this is certainly going to play into the hands of nativist and xenophobic elements in those regions, regardless of whether or not perpetrators turn out to be homegrown or not.
- k-mcgrady 10y ago
  That's the part that's most alarming to me. The incidents are tragic but the long term consequences will also be bad. Xenophobia is getting much too common and a lot of people are pretty open about it now. Brexit hasn't helped that and if further countries follow suit it's only creating more divisions. Every attack like this (although we don't know anything about the perpetrators in this incident yet it's pretty safe to assume) just gives more fuel to the xenophobia in our society.
  - Aelinsaar 10y ago
    Exactly, and ironically terrorists of all stripes seem to be converging on a mutually xenophobic, isolationist ideology. It is unfortunately the real face of that awful phrase from the W. Bush era, "letting the terrorists win". Or at least, letting them experience something like efficacy in their fundamental goals. That should worry us more than it seems to, I think.
  - DominikR 10y ago
    Xenophobia is an _irrational_ fear. It is obviously not irrational to fear this uncontrolled immigration as there are enough fanatics among them that go on a killing spree. Two years ago stuff like this happened rarely, now it is happening regularly. And lets not even get started on the rise in sexual assaults.
xutopia 10y ago
Pretty nice to see that it is still in the news... pretty soon I fear it won't even be newsworthy.
- jessriedel 10y ago
  Seeing as that terrorism is one of the few problems that would literally go away if we ignored it, I hope news readers do become bored with it.
  - DominikR 10y ago
    I wonder how anyone could believe that. In the Middle East they experienced terrorism for decades and it gets only worse.
    - jessriedel 10y ago
      They have news in the Middle East.
      - dogma1138 10y ago
        Yes busses blow up in Israel, markets blow up in Iraq, and schools get blown up in Syria because of news papers.
  - eanzenberg 10y ago
    This isn't fantasy land where you can wish something go away by believing it doesn't exist. You may not value innocent life or freedom but there's plenty of us who do.
    - undersuit 10y ago
      I can value innocent life and freedoms without it being blasted on my media 24/7. The media is biased anyways, my country, the United States, has apparently killed 73 civilians in one Syrian village, Tokkhar, and HN doesn't even have coverage. Media coverage does not help the victims, it glorifies the attackers.
zhengiszen 10y ago
I think you're mistaken. It is European violence and its greed that began this cycle and we are "lucky" to witness decades of injustice...
kyriakos 10y ago
there is still no word if this is an act of terrorism or some deranged person with a weapon.
- DominikR 10y ago
  This is terrorism, police said that multiple shooters are at large. link (sorry, German): http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/muenchen-schuesse-in-olympia-einkaufszentrum-a-1104387.html http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/muenchen-schuesse-in-o...
- tazb 10y ago
  Are those not the samething? I'm sure a terrorist is also a deranged person
  - dogma1138 10y ago
    Yes, but terrorism has a political goal, some one who's simply insane doesn't.

k-mcgrady 10y ago

Facebook have activated their 'Safety Check' feature: https://www.facebook.com/safetycheck/munich-germany-shooting-jul22-2016/ https://www.facebook.com/safetycheck/munich-germany-shooting...

kyriakos 10y ago

live updates from reddit: https://www.reddit.com/live/xatezzbcvxxy https://www.reddit.com/live/xatezzbcvxxy

DominikR 10y ago

This is now close to where I live and the worst part is that this seems to happen now regularly. Merkel is a traitor.

mh-cx 10y ago
At least you have found an opportunity for your political agitation.
- DominikR 10y ago
  As if I would hope for terror attacks near me every week! I didn't care in the slightest about Merkel and German politics before the rapes in Cologne! (I have a successful business, I'm the last one that is unhappy with his situation and wants changes) But now this is my problem, doesn't matter if I want to get involved or not. If we want this to stop we must get rid of Merkel and the refugees.
  - mh-cx 10y ago
    > ... and the refugees We have no Information so far. But you seem to have better sources, that confirm, that each and every refugee is a terrorist. So what do you suggest? [deleted] Sorry, but stereotypes like this really make me sick. You abuse a horrible crime committed by a few to judge over thousands of innocent. EDIT: Removed some too cynical phrase.
- elgabogringo 10y ago
  The political agitators are the people doing the killing, not the person complaining about it.
  - mh-cx 10y ago
    He was not complaining about the killing but about Merkel and the refugee situation. Both are quite unrelated to the shooting. Another disgusting case of short sighted populism.

k-mcgrady 10y ago

Flagged into oblivion within 20mins. I was hoping people would choose the 'hide' option instead of flag but no they chose to kill a discussion for other people they don't want to part of anyway.

eanzenberg 10y ago
Censorship because a biased group's worldview is challenged.
gonvaled 10y ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12099576 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12099576
- k-mcgrady 10y ago
  Good post, that's the impression I get.
- dang 10y ago
  I'd caution against drawing general conclusions about HN from spot observations about what does/doesn't get flagged. People usually fall prey to cognitive biases when they do so, e.g. thinking that the community is against them somehow. We're all primed to feel that way; the feeling just hops to different things depending on our different identities. Occam suggests you needn't look for "Anglo bias" as an explanation for why a story gets flagged when the thread includes "We must get rid of Merkel and the refugees" followed by "What do you suggest, gas chambers?" (Not that there isn't inevitably going to be something like "anglo bias" on an English-language website. But FWIW the moderators here are acutely aware of, and grateful for, and interested in, the international aspects of the community—definitely including the German ones.)
dang 10y ago
The discussion isn't killed; you just posted in it. The issue is what should or shouldn't be on the front page. Users manage most of that; for example, this story fell in rank because they flagged it. Moderators manage some of it too. To look at this meaningfully, you need to take two things into account. First, front page slots are the scarcest resource HN has. Second, HN is a fragile place: the stories we most want here are weaker in many ways (e.g. less agitating) than more sensational material, and also quite a bit rarer. There need to be barriers to the latter or it would flood the site.

zymhan 10y ago

News alert from the Washington Post says at least two dead :/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/german-police-seal-off-mall-area-in-munich-after-shots-fired/2016/07/22/6567e6d8-502c-11e6-a422-83ab49ed5e6a_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/german-police-seal-off-...