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I'm not sure why you think my view is bigoted. I'm not saying he is evil, I don't agree with death penalties anywhere in Turkey our not, I don't think he "degra
by pluma 10y ago
I'm not sure why you think my view is bigoted. I'm not saying he is evil, I don't agree with death penalties anywhere in Turkey our not, I don't think he "degraded morals" (what does that even mean?) and I don't think he has harmed the Turkish economy.
I'm saying he is objectively harming the ideals the Turkish Republic was founded on by Atatürk. I'm not saying this because I think those ideals would allow holding Turkey back for the West to exploit. I'm saying that because I genuinely think Atatürk was a great leader whose principles should be an example for all nations, not just Turkey.
I genuinely wish Germany was founded on Atatürk's principles instead of the mess we have (though I'm well aware of how much worse we could have it). I am genuinely upset by those ideals being betrayed by Erdogan and the Turkish people having chosen a path that stands against everything Turkey was founded on.
I am German, a lot of my classmates in school were Turkish immigrants. I even took a Turkish language course in elementary school (although I can barely remember anything beyond "bir iki üç"). I would have loved to see Turkey succeed as a modern state and become an example other nations in the Islamic world can look up to.
At this point I'm not even sure Turkey would be salvageable if Erdogan was gone. When I said this is a political tragedy, I mean it.
- denzil_correa 10y ago> I genuinely wish Germany was founded on Atatürk's principles instead of the mess we have Curious, what mess does Germany find itself in with respect to Ataturk's principles?
- aws_ls 10y agoI think @pluma means that the mass nationalistic hysteria which was generated after WW1 leading to WW2, would not have happened, if like Turkey military, German military would have preempted all the events by a coup. Also they suggest that the present mass nationalism in Turkey has vague equivalence in what happened in Germany after WW1 leading upto WW2. PS: I am finding this page discussions very educating. Thanks for several comments by @pluma, and also some very good arguments against.