5 ms·

You realize you're not supposed to toss around garbage in the national park?

by krzrak 10y ago

heartsucker 10y ago
Biodegradable apple cores that he was feeding to birds? I think that hardly qualifies.
- cr1895 10y ago
  Well, ideally "leave no trace" and "don't mess with wildlife" are adhered to when in nature edit: it's also illegal in national parks, carrying up to a $5000 fine and six months in jail
  - heartsucker 10y ago
    Yes, I have spent a lot of time out in nature and parks, and I generally am aware of not leaving a trace or litter. However, with something like a banana peel, I'd rather it end up as tree food the in a landfill, so I usually toss them in bushes.
    - eseehausen 10y ago
      The issue is that leaving food for the animals alters their behavior and can cause issues. You're probably not the worst offender wherever you are, as there are many people who just give food to animals, but the argument would be that it contributes to the problem.
    - gerbilly 10y ago
      Actually banana peels and orange peels don't biodegrade that fast in a north American forest. Apple cores I think might not be too bad to toss, ants can eat that up in a day or two. I pack out the peels of any tropical fruit.
    - waterphone 10y ago
      Please don't do that with banana or orange peels, they remain present for a long time. I have no problem personally with people tossing apple cores in more remote, little-visited areas (though it still makes sense to crack down on such things a bit more in heavily visited areas like National Parks) but various peels don't rot well and remain in place.
- seszett 10y ago
  I'm not sure about Yosemite or even nature in the US so maybe this wouldn't be an issue, but even biodegradable things like apple cores or egg shells can spread diseases to local populations of trees or birds. That's a real thing to take into account in natural parks with endemic species at least.
  - heartsucker 10y ago
    Huh. I didn't know. Do you have a link on that?
    - seszett 10y ago
      I don't have a link though, it's just something that was been repeated at length by the Natural Reserve agents and the ecobiologists to the personnel and visitors while I was on Kerguelen island (precisely about apple cores and egg shells - most of the vegetation is actually in the same Rosaceae family as apple trees, and there are many local bird species). It makes sense to me, seeing how a single disease like chestnut blight or phylloxera can be very devastating to a population on a whole continent, it could be both as bad but also less noticeable in a natural park.
- emiliobumachar 10y ago
  Well, there are seeds in it...
- nommm-nommm 10y ago
  In the very least it's unsightly. Thousands of people go to Yosemite, imagine if every one of them dropped food debris along the trail.
obj-g 10y ago
Boy, there's one in every thread, huh?
Unklejoe 10y ago
Here's a different perspective, which I will admit in advance is kind of ridiculous, but it makes me think... Why are humans not considered to be a part of nature? I think it’s because we consider ourselves to be more intelligent than other animals/organisms and therefore assume it to be our responsibility to actively protect nature. However, this is based on our own moral standards, which were created by us, likely as a result of our ability to empathize. A human eating an apple and discarding the core seems pretty natural to me (though it’s not, by definition). If this has an impact on the wildlife population, then perhaps it was “meant to be”. Going out of our way to preserve nature seems more unnatural. Nature should have no expectation of our intelligence, so perhaps the human-caused destruction of the world is itself natural. Then again, perhaps our increased intelligence is natural, so going out of our way to preserve nature is natural. As you can see, I basically have no point here. It’s just an interesting thought train that I felt like expressing. Of course, this argument could be extended to just about anything that a human does, including pumping oil directly into the ocean, which is why I’m not actually trying to argue this point. I guess what I am saying is that if humans are left unregulated, nature seems to find a way to restore sanity. An example of this is the over prescription of antibiotics which has led to a decrease in their overall effectiveness. It seems like nature will always win in the end.
- coldpie 10y ago
  Unregulated humans have lead to the extinction of hundreds (thousands?) of species. Largely by hunting, but also unintentionally by destroying habitats. It's also a safety hazard: when you feed wild animals, they learn to associate humans with food and are more willing to approach humans, which places humans in danger. Aside from animal welfare, garbage is just disgusting. If one person sees an apple core, perhaps they'll assume it's OK to leave their Doritos bag, and someone else a beer bottle, and now the area is spoiled for everyone. Not to mention health hazards for both humans and animals from rotting food.
  - tripzilch 10y ago
    > If one person sees an apple core, perhaps they'll assume it's OK to leave their Doritos bag Let me nuance that a little bit: They don't actually believe it's OK, they're really just lazy and inconsiderate. If they were actually unaware of the difference between food and plastic packaging, the problem would be solving itself.
sirtastic 10y ago
It was an apple grown in one of the 3 orchards around Yosemite purchased from the store in the valley. It was a native apple. Also, I don't consider biodegradable native fruits to be trash. People argue the birds will choke on seeds or something which is absurd. I hike in Yosemite dozens of times a year and I can't recall ever seeing so much as banana peel and I know people are tossing those on the ground everywhere.

You realize you're not supposed to toss around garbage in the national park?

by krzrak 10y ago

You realize you're not supposed to toss around garbage in the national park?

heartsucker 10y ago

Biodegradable apple cores that he was feeding to birds? I think that hardly qualifies.

cr1895 10y ago
Well, ideally "leave no trace" and "don't mess with wildlife" are adhered to when in nature edit: it's also illegal in national parks, carrying up to a $5000 fine and six months in jail
- heartsucker 10y ago
  Yes, I have spent a lot of time out in nature and parks, and I generally am aware of not leaving a trace or litter. However, with something like a banana peel, I'd rather it end up as tree food the in a landfill, so I usually toss them in bushes.
  - eseehausen 10y ago
    The issue is that leaving food for the animals alters their behavior and can cause issues. You're probably not the worst offender wherever you are, as there are many people who just give food to animals, but the argument would be that it contributes to the problem.
  - gerbilly 10y ago
    Actually banana peels and orange peels don't biodegrade that fast in a north American forest. Apple cores I think might not be too bad to toss, ants can eat that up in a day or two. I pack out the peels of any tropical fruit.
  - waterphone 10y ago
    Please don't do that with banana or orange peels, they remain present for a long time. I have no problem personally with people tossing apple cores in more remote, little-visited areas (though it still makes sense to crack down on such things a bit more in heavily visited areas like National Parks) but various peels don't rot well and remain in place.
seszett 10y ago
I'm not sure about Yosemite or even nature in the US so maybe this wouldn't be an issue, but even biodegradable things like apple cores or egg shells can spread diseases to local populations of trees or birds. That's a real thing to take into account in natural parks with endemic species at least.
- heartsucker 10y ago
  Huh. I didn't know. Do you have a link on that?
  - seszett 10y ago
    I don't have a link though, it's just something that was been repeated at length by the Natural Reserve agents and the ecobiologists to the personnel and visitors while I was on Kerguelen island (precisely about apple cores and egg shells - most of the vegetation is actually in the same Rosaceae family as apple trees, and there are many local bird species). It makes sense to me, seeing how a single disease like chestnut blight or phylloxera can be very devastating to a population on a whole continent, it could be both as bad but also less noticeable in a natural park.
emiliobumachar 10y ago
Well, there are seeds in it...
nommm-nommm 10y ago
In the very least it's unsightly. Thousands of people go to Yosemite, imagine if every one of them dropped food debris along the trail.

obj-g 10y ago

Boy, there's one in every thread, huh?

Unklejoe 10y ago

Here's a different perspective, which I will admit in advance is kind of ridiculous, but it makes me think... Why are humans not considered to be a part of nature? I think it’s because we consider ourselves to be more intelligent than other animals/organisms and therefore assume it to be our responsibility to actively protect nature. However, this is based on our own moral standards, which were created by us, likely as a result of our ability to empathize. A human eating an apple and discarding the core seems pretty natural to me (though it’s not, by definition). If this has an impact on the wildlife population, then perhaps it was “meant to be”. Going out of our way to preserve nature seems more unnatural. Nature should have no expectation of our intelligence, so perhaps the human-caused destruction of the world is itself natural. Then again, perhaps our increased intelligence is natural, so going out of our way to preserve nature is natural. As you can see, I basically have no point here. It’s just an interesting thought train that I felt like expressing. Of course, this argument could be extended to just about anything that a human does, including pumping oil directly into the ocean, which is why I’m not actually trying to argue this point. I guess what I am saying is that if humans are left unregulated, nature seems to find a way to restore sanity. An example of this is the over prescription of antibiotics which has led to a decrease in their overall effectiveness. It seems like nature will always win in the end.

coldpie 10y ago
Unregulated humans have lead to the extinction of hundreds (thousands?) of species. Largely by hunting, but also unintentionally by destroying habitats. It's also a safety hazard: when you feed wild animals, they learn to associate humans with food and are more willing to approach humans, which places humans in danger. Aside from animal welfare, garbage is just disgusting. If one person sees an apple core, perhaps they'll assume it's OK to leave their Doritos bag, and someone else a beer bottle, and now the area is spoiled for everyone. Not to mention health hazards for both humans and animals from rotting food.
- tripzilch 10y ago
  > If one person sees an apple core, perhaps they'll assume it's OK to leave their Doritos bag Let me nuance that a little bit: They don't actually believe it's OK, they're really just lazy and inconsiderate. If they were actually unaware of the difference between food and plastic packaging, the problem would be solving itself.

sirtastic 10y ago

It was an apple grown in one of the 3 orchards around Yosemite purchased from the store in the valley. It was a native apple. Also, I don't consider biodegradable native fruits to be trash. People argue the birds will choke on seeds or something which is absurd. I hike in Yosemite dozens of times a year and I can't recall ever seeing so much as banana peel and I know people are tossing those on the ground everywhere.