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It's a format that doesn't lend itself very well to the current model of code-bootcamps-and-hello-world-tutorials. Now that I think about it, the zeitgeist her

by tomc1985 10y ago

It's a format that doesn't lend itself very well to the current model of code-bootcamps-and-hello-world-tutorials. Now that I think about it, the zeitgeist here really does feel like those cheesy "Learn C++ in just 20 minutes a day!!!!!" books

Silhouette 10y ago
The thing is, producing good software at any serious scale and maintaining it for any serious length of time needs more skill and understanding than you can learn from a 10 minute tutorial video and a couple of blog posts. There seems to be a new generation of developers who think that 10,000 lines of code is a big program, a web app doesn't need to last more than a year or maybe two at most, and any sort of in-house programming or software design work will be inherently inferior to any external code you can import instead. These people are probably doomed no matter what they do. There's a certain irony that in the one clear exception to that rule -- if you really are building a throwaway MVP in the expectation that it will either fail quickly or succeed enough be be worth rewriting properly later -- it mostly doesn't matter what tools or practices you follow. As long as you have some basic competence regarding security and you're keeping any important data somewhere safe so it can be transferred reliably to a new system later, the strategy is what it is. However, that also means many of the claimed advantages of frameworks are irrelevant to such projects, because you don't really care about things like longevity or being able to hire more developers already familiar with the framework or keeping growing teams consistent in how they design a growing code base.
- dozzie 10y ago
  > There seems to be a new generation of developers who think that 10,000 lines of code is a big program This one made my day xD 10kLOC is a top limit for my programs (I say that whatever has higher line count starts boring me), and those were just small tools for sysadmins since forever.

Silhouette 10y ago

The thing is, producing good software at any serious scale and maintaining it for any serious length of time needs more skill and understanding than you can learn from a 10 minute tutorial video and a couple of blog posts. There seems to be a new generation of developers who think that 10,000 lines of code is a big program, a web app doesn't need to last more than a year or maybe two at most, and any sort of in-house programming or software design work will be inherently inferior to any external code you can import instead. These people are probably doomed no matter what they do. There's a certain irony that in the one clear exception to that rule -- if you really are building a throwaway MVP in the expectation that it will either fail quickly or succeed enough be be worth rewriting properly later -- it mostly doesn't matter what tools or practices you follow. As long as you have some basic competence regarding security and you're keeping any important data somewhere safe so it can be transferred reliably to a new system later, the strategy is what it is. However, that also means many of the claimed advantages of frameworks are irrelevant to such projects, because you don't really care about things like longevity or being able to hire more developers already familiar with the framework or keeping growing teams consistent in how they design a growing code base.

dozzie 10y ago
> There seems to be a new generation of developers who think that 10,000 lines of code is a big program This one made my day xD 10kLOC is a top limit for my programs (I say that whatever has higher line count starts boring me), and those were just small tools for sysadmins since forever.