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I really like using Opera on Linux. It is the only full featured browser that has good, scalable UI and touch input support. And builtin adblocking + "battery s

by jacek 10y ago

I really like using Opera on Linux. It is the only full featured browser that has good, scalable UI and touch input support. And builtin adblocking + "battery saver mode" (developer version only) are really good additions. However, I do not trust Chinese companies with my data, I will need to switch to Firefox soon.

digi_owl 10y ago
May give Vivaldi a look. Made by many of the original Opera people. https://vivaldi.com/ https://vivaldi.com/
- subie 10y ago
  is this using electron?
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - zdkl 10y ago
    Vivaldi is built on Chromium I believe
  - city41 10y ago
    Doesn't look to be using Electron, as Vivaldi.app/Contents/Frameworks does not contain the Electron framework.
- jacek 10y ago
  Thanks, I will give it a try again, but the last time I didn't like the UI.
  - Teksource 10y ago
    The UI is great. But if you do not like it, customize it, either with massive CSS rewrites or the built inside customization options.
    - jacek 10y ago
      I just found this: https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-customizable-ui-themes# https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-cu...! (dev version). It allows full customization with CSS! That's great!
      - CyberShadow 10y ago
        A little-known fact, but you can customize the Firefox UI with CSS too: http://kb.mozillazine.org/UserChrome.css http://kb.mozillazine.org/UserChrome.css My Firefox currently looks like this: https://dump.thecybershadow.net/0177f0cecdf6ad3b65158858a210805d/firefox.png https://dump.thecybershadow.net/0177f0cecdf6ad3b65158858a210...
        hello_asdf 10y ago
        Would you share your userchrome.css file? Thanks.
        SturgeonsLaw 10y ago
        Wow, that looks very cool. I'd also be interested in seeing the CSS behind that if you don't mind sharing?
  - vasili111 10y ago
    https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-customizable-ui-themes https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-cu...
- dingdingdang 10y ago
  But Vivaldi == "We use JavaScript and React to create the user interface with the help of Node.js and a long list of NPM modules. Vivaldi is the web built with the web.". Which again equals: do I really want to trust that browser knowing how NPM modules are basically the least secure thing ever?
  - RubyPinch 10y ago
    a) that wouldn't affect a build, assuming they cache their packages, which they probably would since that event b) didn't they change their unpublishing policy after that event?
- Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
  Vivaldi is closed source.
  - Fej 10y ago
    ...why? That doesn't make any sense.
    - JohnTHaller 10y ago
      "Competitive advantage" most likely. They built their own HTML-based UI on top of Chromium. So, their browser engine is just Chrome/Chromium/Blink, not something unique. Vivaldi can't even sync your bookmarks between devices yet (at least the last time I checked).
  - Mithaldu 10y ago
    Not entirely: https://vivaldi.com/source/?lang=en https://vivaldi.com/source/?lang=en
    - Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
      That's just their chromium patches. You can't build vivaldi from that.
syoc 10y ago
I don't understand why people instantly go to the uninstall step when we are talking about the Chinese acquiring information, but the USG is fine. At least you most likely don't live in the country obtaining potentially incriminating information (if that is your worry).
- jacek 10y ago
  Well, I do not use Chrome for the same reason. I am also in the process of migrating from Google to services in countries that respect privacy and do not share data with governments without a warrant.
  - mark_l_watson 10y ago
    Do you mind listing alternative services that you are looking at?
    - towercap 10y ago
      For me, DuckDuckGo replaced Google, FastMail replaced Gmail and SpiderOak replaced Google Drive. Some trade-offs, but nothing too painful.
      - lyonlim 10y ago
        I looked at SpiderOak...but their mobile apps really need some work..that's the only thing holding me back. How's your experience using SpiderOak?
    - lyonlim 10y ago
      ProtonMail looks interesting as well. They recently added support for custom domains.
    - jacek 10y ago
      I use DuckDuckGo for search, Kolabnow for email, OwnCloud (owncube.com) for files, calendar, contacts. Unfortunately, I still use Google Services on my phone to use Google Play store for apps. I see no viable alternative for now.
kccqzy 10y ago
I typically don't have this instinctive bias against Chinese companies (they manufacture lots of great products), but I've actually heard of the leading buyer, Qihoo 360. I remember they used to release some "security software" for Windows that disabled the builtin Windows update and replaced it with their own mechanism. They also used to have their own "secure browser" that was nothing more than a shell over Trident and Webkit. I'm not sure I can find references for those claims as this was a very long time ago. But I just navigated to their official website (they seem to have two, http://www.360.com http://www.360.com and http://www.360.cn http://www.360.cn ) and guess what. The year is 2016 and a security company's official website doesn't support HTTPS. It doesn't work on my computer and hopefully this isn't due to China's firewall.
- Fej 10y ago
  The problem isn't necessarily the companies, it's that the government is in league with the companies and/or outright owns and runs them, so people are concerned about the Chinese government having their data. I am too, and I imagine most people here are as well.
  - curt15 10y ago
    >The problem isn't necessarily the companies, it's that the government is in league with the companies and/or outright owns and runs them But that is precisely why people distrust the companies.
  - lucb1e 10y ago
    Probably an unpopular opinion here, but for that matter, should I trust the American government? I'm not one of its citizens and deemed fine to spy on by American laws.
    - Wingman4l7 10y ago
      The American government has, historically, been more reluctant to disappear citizens whose viewpoints it disagrees with.
vasili111 10y ago
You can switch also to Vivaldi.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
dmix 10y ago
I'm still waiting for Chromium builds to work on Android, personally. I trust the security acumen of the 'many eyes' who work on that project much more than Opera or Firefox. And Google doesn't vacuum up any data unless you volunteer it in Chrome. That's been proven.

by jacek 10y ago

digi_owl 10y ago

May give Vivaldi a look. Made by many of the original Opera people. https://vivaldi.com/ https://vivaldi.com/

subie 10y ago
is this using electron?
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- zdkl 10y ago
  Vivaldi is built on Chromium I believe
- city41 10y ago
  Doesn't look to be using Electron, as Vivaldi.app/Contents/Frameworks does not contain the Electron framework.
jacek 10y ago
Thanks, I will give it a try again, but the last time I didn't like the UI.
- Teksource 10y ago
  The UI is great. But if you do not like it, customize it, either with massive CSS rewrites or the built inside customization options.
  - jacek 10y ago
    I just found this: https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-customizable-ui-themes# https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-cu...! (dev version). It allows full customization with CSS! That's great!
    - CyberShadow 10y ago
      A little-known fact, but you can customize the Firefox UI with CSS too: http://kb.mozillazine.org/UserChrome.css http://kb.mozillazine.org/UserChrome.css My Firefox currently looks like this: https://dump.thecybershadow.net/0177f0cecdf6ad3b65158858a210805d/firefox.png https://dump.thecybershadow.net/0177f0cecdf6ad3b65158858a210...
      - hello_asdf 10y ago
        Would you share your userchrome.css file? Thanks.
      - SturgeonsLaw 10y ago
        Wow, that looks very cool. I'd also be interested in seeing the CSS behind that if you don't mind sharing?
- vasili111 10y ago
  https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-customizable-ui-themes https://vivaldi.net/en-US/teamblog/121-snapshot-1-3-501-6-cu...
dingdingdang 10y ago
But Vivaldi == "We use JavaScript and React to create the user interface with the help of Node.js and a long list of NPM modules. Vivaldi is the web built with the web.". Which again equals: do I really want to trust that browser knowing how NPM modules are basically the least secure thing ever?
- RubyPinch 10y ago
  a) that wouldn't affect a build, assuming they cache their packages, which they probably would since that event b) didn't they change their unpublishing policy after that event?
Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
Vivaldi is closed source.
- Fej 10y ago
  ...why? That doesn't make any sense.
  - JohnTHaller 10y ago
    "Competitive advantage" most likely. They built their own HTML-based UI on top of Chromium. So, their browser engine is just Chrome/Chromium/Blink, not something unique. Vivaldi can't even sync your bookmarks between devices yet (at least the last time I checked).
- Mithaldu 10y ago
  Not entirely: https://vivaldi.com/source/?lang=en https://vivaldi.com/source/?lang=en
  - Sir_Cmpwn 10y ago
    That's just their chromium patches. You can't build vivaldi from that.

syoc 10y ago

I don't understand why people instantly go to the uninstall step when we are talking about the Chinese acquiring information, but the USG is fine. At least you most likely don't live in the country obtaining potentially incriminating information (if that is your worry).

jacek 10y ago
Well, I do not use Chrome for the same reason. I am also in the process of migrating from Google to services in countries that respect privacy and do not share data with governments without a warrant.
- mark_l_watson 10y ago
  Do you mind listing alternative services that you are looking at?
  - towercap 10y ago
    For me, DuckDuckGo replaced Google, FastMail replaced Gmail and SpiderOak replaced Google Drive. Some trade-offs, but nothing too painful.
    - lyonlim 10y ago
      I looked at SpiderOak...but their mobile apps really need some work..that's the only thing holding me back. How's your experience using SpiderOak?
  - lyonlim 10y ago
    ProtonMail looks interesting as well. They recently added support for custom domains.
  - jacek 10y ago
    I use DuckDuckGo for search, Kolabnow for email, OwnCloud (owncube.com) for files, calendar, contacts. Unfortunately, I still use Google Services on my phone to use Google Play store for apps. I see no viable alternative for now.

kccqzy 10y ago

I typically don't have this instinctive bias against Chinese companies (they manufacture lots of great products), but I've actually heard of the leading buyer, Qihoo 360. I remember they used to release some "security software" for Windows that disabled the builtin Windows update and replaced it with their own mechanism. They also used to have their own "secure browser" that was nothing more than a shell over Trident and Webkit. I'm not sure I can find references for those claims as this was a very long time ago. But I just navigated to their official website (they seem to have two, http://www.360.com http://www.360.com and http://www.360.cn http://www.360.cn ) and guess what. The year is 2016 and a security company's official website doesn't support HTTPS. It doesn't work on my computer and hopefully this isn't due to China's firewall.

Fej 10y ago
The problem isn't necessarily the companies, it's that the government is in league with the companies and/or outright owns and runs them, so people are concerned about the Chinese government having their data. I am too, and I imagine most people here are as well.
- curt15 10y ago
  >The problem isn't necessarily the companies, it's that the government is in league with the companies and/or outright owns and runs them But that is precisely why people distrust the companies.
- lucb1e 10y ago
  Probably an unpopular opinion here, but for that matter, should I trust the American government? I'm not one of its citizens and deemed fine to spy on by American laws.
  - Wingman4l7 10y ago
    The American government has, historically, been more reluctant to disappear citizens whose viewpoints it disagrees with.

vasili111 10y ago

You can switch also to Vivaldi.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

dmix 10y ago

I'm still waiting for Chromium builds to work on Android, personally. I trust the security acumen of the 'many eyes' who work on that project much more than Opera or Firefox. And Google doesn't vacuum up any data unless you volunteer it in Chrome. That's been proven.