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It is bad that a (mostly) democratic elected government is (tried to be) removed this way. This will make it really difficult to work with whoever is in power,

It is bad that a (mostly) democratic elected government is (tried to be) removed this way. This will make it really difficult to work with whoever is in power, internationally. But Erdogan forced this on the military. They were told to stand down against ISIS and to fight a new impossible-to-win fight against the kurdish minority. I really hope the situation will somehow calm down. Otherwise we could have a new civil war at our hands, forcing more people to cross (those stupid) national borders to find safety.

calibraxis 10y ago
At least the coup leaders and the US State Dept are sending sensible signals. John Kerry's waiting to see who wins before committing (Erdogan frustrates the US, and many assumed the US would try to overthrow him), and the coup leaders are reassuring Turkey's powerful allies. "U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry says he hopes for stability and continuity in Turkey following reports that an attempted military coup is under way in the NATO member state." (http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-07-15/kerry-hopes-for-continuity-in-turkey-amid-coup-reports http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-07-15/kerr...) “Turkish Armed Forces have completely taken over the administration of the country to reinstate constitutional order, human rights and freedoms, the rule of law and the general security that was damaged,” the military said in a statement. “All international agreements are still valid. We hope that all of our good relationships with all countries will continue.” (https://www.rt.com/news/351343-turkey-coup-military-attempt/ https://www.rt.com/news/351343-turkey-coup-military-attempt/)
- ZainRiz 10y ago
  Any source for "many assumed the US would try to overthrow him"? That would imply that this coup might actually have been initiated by the US (it wouldn't be the first time the US caused a coup in another country)
  - calibraxis 10y ago
    Yes, take David Graeber, who's written extensively on Turkey and the extraordinary revolutionary Kurds: https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/700436062469038080 https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/700436062469038080 and https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/754071680977399808 https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/754071680977399808 (Regardless of particulars — did the US initiate it? support it? simply signal they'd stand back and let a friendly coup happen? — he has a good predictive mental model.)
gkya 10y ago
The elections however were a great mess. On the first election on 7th june 15 AKP was 40%, but opposition failed to form coalition and Erdogan abused power as head of state to fill up 45 days w/o a new govt so that elections would be repeated. So happened, elections were to be repeated on 10th november the same year, and in the meantime the war on PKK started, major attacks by ISIS happened, and people feared unstability and voted for AKP. The two of the parties that could have formed a coalition are MHP, the turkish extremist-nationalists, and HDP, kurdish socialist-nationalists, so not all that compatible. Also, the legality of those last elections are doubted. Since the beginnings of this decade, we're an extremely polarised society, with more than two poles, and any issue is extremely complex. This last madness will augment all these problems, and if it fails, it won't be like in the past the same. "A stick with two shitty ends," we say.
- einrealist 10y ago
  I agree. The election was a shit show. In addition, Erdogan's apparatus attacked liberal institutions and people with investigations and law suits. But Erdogan would not be able to do so, if he had not have the support of a majority. So in a way, its a somewhat weird, imperfect democratic process. My hope is with the young turkish people, to influence the situation in a good way. Maybe this will trigger a much stronger democratic process. Anyhow, Erdogan should step down.
vacri 10y ago
Turkey has a history of these kinds of coups. The reason why it hasn't happened earlier in Erdogan's reign is because Turkey is trying to join the EU, and military coups work against that as it means the state is not stable. However, Turkey is interesting in that the military coups are usually conducted in the name of freeing the people, rather than oppressing them. Usually it's just naked power grabs.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  Military coups are almost always in the name of freeing the people. If Turkey is special, its because its military coups actually end up doing something like that in previous, not that they are in the name of it.

calibraxis 10y ago

At least the coup leaders and the US State Dept are sending sensible signals. John Kerry's waiting to see who wins before committing (Erdogan frustrates the US, and many assumed the US would try to overthrow him), and the coup leaders are reassuring Turkey's powerful allies. "U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry says he hopes for stability and continuity in Turkey following reports that an attempted military coup is under way in the NATO member state." (http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-07-15/kerry-hopes-for-continuity-in-turkey-amid-coup-reports http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-07-15/kerr...) “Turkish Armed Forces have completely taken over the administration of the country to reinstate constitutional order, human rights and freedoms, the rule of law and the general security that was damaged,” the military said in a statement. “All international agreements are still valid. We hope that all of our good relationships with all countries will continue.” (https://www.rt.com/news/351343-turkey-coup-military-attempt/ https://www.rt.com/news/351343-turkey-coup-military-attempt/)

ZainRiz 10y ago
Any source for "many assumed the US would try to overthrow him"? That would imply that this coup might actually have been initiated by the US (it wouldn't be the first time the US caused a coup in another country)
- calibraxis 10y ago
  Yes, take David Graeber, who's written extensively on Turkey and the extraordinary revolutionary Kurds: https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/700436062469038080 https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/700436062469038080 and https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/754071680977399808 https://twitter.com/davidgraeber/status/754071680977399808 (Regardless of particulars — did the US initiate it? support it? simply signal they'd stand back and let a friendly coup happen? — he has a good predictive mental model.)

gkya 10y ago

The elections however were a great mess. On the first election on 7th june 15 AKP was 40%, but opposition failed to form coalition and Erdogan abused power as head of state to fill up 45 days w/o a new govt so that elections would be repeated. So happened, elections were to be repeated on 10th november the same year, and in the meantime the war on PKK started, major attacks by ISIS happened, and people feared unstability and voted for AKP. The two of the parties that could have formed a coalition are MHP, the turkish extremist-nationalists, and HDP, kurdish socialist-nationalists, so not all that compatible. Also, the legality of those last elections are doubted. Since the beginnings of this decade, we're an extremely polarised society, with more than two poles, and any issue is extremely complex. This last madness will augment all these problems, and if it fails, it won't be like in the past the same. "A stick with two shitty ends," we say.

einrealist 10y ago
I agree. The election was a shit show. In addition, Erdogan's apparatus attacked liberal institutions and people with investigations and law suits. But Erdogan would not be able to do so, if he had not have the support of a majority. So in a way, its a somewhat weird, imperfect democratic process. My hope is with the young turkish people, to influence the situation in a good way. Maybe this will trigger a much stronger democratic process. Anyhow, Erdogan should step down.

vacri 10y ago

Turkey has a history of these kinds of coups. The reason why it hasn't happened earlier in Erdogan's reign is because Turkey is trying to join the EU, and military coups work against that as it means the state is not stable. However, Turkey is interesting in that the military coups are usually conducted in the name of freeing the people, rather than oppressing them. Usually it's just naked power grabs.

dragonwriter 10y ago
Military coups are almost always in the name of freeing the people. If Turkey is special, its because its military coups actually end up doing something like that in previous, not that they are in the name of it.