7 ms·

>There's also the issue that "guests" have a higher tendency to break things. So discriminate against guests based on statistics related to members of their gr

by aminok 10y ago

>There's also the issue that "guests" have a higher tendency to break things. So discriminate against guests based on statistics related to members of their group? That sounds familiar...... If there is a problem behavior, that behavior should be punished. Entire classes of people shouldn't have their economic rights limited based on a blanket characterisation.

varjag 10y ago
Corporation's customer is not a protected class.
- aminok 10y ago
  So because we haven't created a law designating some group, defined by the consensual behavior they have in common, a protected class, it's morally okay to discriminate against them? Also, you mention "corporation's customers", so am I correct to assume that you ascribe to a moral system that sees anything that is associated with corporations as immoral and fair game for mistreatment and discrimination?
  - varjag 10y ago
    I said "corporation's customers" because AirBNB is a corporation, don't read between the lines too hard. Protected classes are not arbitrary, in most cases they are groups of people who are not self-selected. You can't easily change your age or skin color, but it is trival to use booking.com instead of airbnb. Likening your right to party 0300 in an airbnb rental flat to civil rights movement is disingenuous.
    - aminok 10y ago
      You didn't answer my question. If you believed your ideology was morally right, you would not shy away from directly answering questions about its values. Here's the question again: So because we haven't created a law designating some group, defined by the consensual behavior they have in common, a protected class, it's morally okay to discriminate against them?
      - varjag 10y ago
        I have to gently remind that am not a subordinate to you of any kind and don't have to keep up with your agenda. That said I'm entirely fine with corporations, their customers and free markets. It is not illegal to discriminate against a group not protected legally, and often even a moral thing to do. I discriminate against assholes all the time by not giving an equal weight to their opinion.
        aminok 10y ago
        It is is not illegal to discriminate against them, but it is immoral. Renting someone else's property is not immoral. Threatening to rob (fine) or imprison someone for engaging in any kind of consensual transaction, including short term rental, is immoral.
JohnTHaller 10y ago
The reason guests is in quotes is because it's a silly term used by people in the "sharing" economy... sharing being another misnomer. They're not a guest, they're a customer of a (generally) illegally sold service... note the fact that it is "sold" not "shared". The same way Airbnb disingenuously airs ads in NYC about families "sharing" a room in their apartment and cooking meals for "guests" occasionally as a way to make ends meet when, in actually, most of Airbnb's revenue in NYC is made from illegal whole apartment rentals. Entire classes of people who illegally operate unlicensed hotels and put additional upward pressure on rental prices in the surrounding market in addition to inconveniencing and affecting the safety and quality of life of neighbors should absolutely have "their economic rights" limited.
- aminok 10y ago
  The fact that the service is illegal is a human rights violation. Liberal ideology is authoritarian and human rights violating.
  - JohnTHaller 10y ago
    It's also against the terms of their lease... you know the thing they signed with the person who actually owns said property. In your odd world view... the renter should be allowed to do whatever they'd like? Setup a chem lab. Start an auto repair business. Install a few factory machines and start manufacturing widgets in their third floor walkup.
    - aminok 10y ago
      It's odd that you think the only people renting places out on Airbnb are non-owner lease holders. Anti-short-term-rental laws apply to owners who rent their property out short term as well. I'm only referring to this subset of short term rentals.

by aminok 10y ago

varjag 10y ago

Corporation's customer is not a protected class.

aminok 10y ago
So because we haven't created a law designating some group, defined by the consensual behavior they have in common, a protected class, it's morally okay to discriminate against them? Also, you mention "corporation's customers", so am I correct to assume that you ascribe to a moral system that sees anything that is associated with corporations as immoral and fair game for mistreatment and discrimination?
- varjag 10y ago
  I said "corporation's customers" because AirBNB is a corporation, don't read between the lines too hard. Protected classes are not arbitrary, in most cases they are groups of people who are not self-selected. You can't easily change your age or skin color, but it is trival to use booking.com instead of airbnb. Likening your right to party 0300 in an airbnb rental flat to civil rights movement is disingenuous.
  - aminok 10y ago
    You didn't answer my question. If you believed your ideology was morally right, you would not shy away from directly answering questions about its values. Here's the question again: So because we haven't created a law designating some group, defined by the consensual behavior they have in common, a protected class, it's morally okay to discriminate against them?
    - varjag 10y ago
      I have to gently remind that am not a subordinate to you of any kind and don't have to keep up with your agenda. That said I'm entirely fine with corporations, their customers and free markets. It is not illegal to discriminate against a group not protected legally, and often even a moral thing to do. I discriminate against assholes all the time by not giving an equal weight to their opinion.
      - aminok 10y ago
        It is is not illegal to discriminate against them, but it is immoral. Renting someone else's property is not immoral. Threatening to rob (fine) or imprison someone for engaging in any kind of consensual transaction, including short term rental, is immoral.

JohnTHaller 10y ago

The reason guests is in quotes is because it's a silly term used by people in the "sharing" economy... sharing being another misnomer. They're not a guest, they're a customer of a (generally) illegally sold service... note the fact that it is "sold" not "shared". The same way Airbnb disingenuously airs ads in NYC about families "sharing" a room in their apartment and cooking meals for "guests" occasionally as a way to make ends meet when, in actually, most of Airbnb's revenue in NYC is made from illegal whole apartment rentals. Entire classes of people who illegally operate unlicensed hotels and put additional upward pressure on rental prices in the surrounding market in addition to inconveniencing and affecting the safety and quality of life of neighbors should absolutely have "their economic rights" limited.

aminok 10y ago
The fact that the service is illegal is a human rights violation. Liberal ideology is authoritarian and human rights violating.
- JohnTHaller 10y ago
  It's also against the terms of their lease... you know the thing they signed with the person who actually owns said property. In your odd world view... the renter should be allowed to do whatever they'd like? Setup a chem lab. Start an auto repair business. Install a few factory machines and start manufacturing widgets in their third floor walkup.
  - aminok 10y ago
    It's odd that you think the only people renting places out on Airbnb are non-owner lease holders. Anti-short-term-rental laws apply to owners who rent their property out short term as well. I'm only referring to this subset of short term rentals.