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Am I'm reading either the headline or the announcement wrong? As I read it, they are not shipping Rust but a component written in Rust. > For this reason,

Am I'm reading either the headline or the announcement wrong? As I read it, they are not shipping Rust but a component written in Rust. > For this reason, Ralph Giles and Matthew Gregan built Mozilla’s first Rust > media parser. And I’m happy to report that their code will be the first > Rust component shipping in Firefox.

Manishearth 10y ago
That is correct. "Shipping Rust code in Firefox" is what it's about. Though really "Shipping Rust in Firefox" means that too, it's just a bit ambiguous.
- Noseshine 10y ago
  I would expect the phrase "shipping Rust" to mean that they include the language environment, so that I can write code in Rust with Mozilla.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - wyager 10y ago
    That doesn't make sense. It is a statically compiled systems-oriented language, not a web-oriented language.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
    - maxerickson 10y ago
      The headline is nerdview. http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=26094 http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=26094
      - smt88 10y ago
        There is a whole article that explains the headline. The headline can't include 100% of background.
        Noseshine 10y ago
        But a headline can be correct or incorrect. That they changed the headline shows a lot of users thought it was incorrect.
      - hyperpape 10y ago
        I'd say it's nerdview that's going to be read by nerds, and that unlike the examples in that lovely post, it will be understood by the majority of people who read it.
        maxerickson 10y ago
        Sure, it wasn't egregious, but I think the insider perspective idea has lots of explanatory power when it comes to the confusion Noseshine expressed and the surprise wyager responded to the confusion with.
        hyperpape 10y ago
        Well, obviously we can disagree and I could be wrong, but I think Noseshine's response was a "man bites dog" situation. After thinking about it, I'd still expect the intended audience to see it.
        Noseshine 10y ago
        What does "man bites dog situation" mean? Looking at the Wikipedia explanation for the phrase in the context of journalism it supports my question about the title: Extreme and rare events are more likely to be reported. Obviously shipping "Rust code" is much less noteworthy than "shipping Rust" would be.
    - Noseshine 10y ago
      Of course it doesn't make sense. I'm talking about what the the headline says.
    - Sanddancer 10y ago
      Other browsers have support for statically compiled, safe, systems-oriented languages built in. https://developer.chrome.com/native-client https://developer.chrome.com/native-client
- sctb 10y ago
  Thanks, we updated the HN title to the much more unambiguous form.
awalGarg 10y ago
Sort of offtopic, but.. since Manish has already clarified the intent below... I am just curious - would you have drawn a similar conclusion from the headline if the language in question was not Rust, but a more popular/stable one, like say JavaScript/C? "Shipping C in Firefox"? (asking purely from a linguistic point of view)
- frewsxcv 10y ago
  What do you find unstable about Rust?
  - awalGarg 10y ago
    Err, I didn't mean to say that Rust is unstable in the literal sense. Apologies! Just meant to highlight its "newness" in the given context (i.e., relative to other languages) :)
akerro 10y ago
You did not think, they would replace VanillaJS with Rust, did you? ;)
- smt88 10y ago
  This will happen. Rust can already be compiled to JS, although that's not very practical for client-side work right now. When WebAssembly is finished, stable, and widespread, I guarantee people will be using end-to-end Rust (among other languages).
- Noseshine 10y ago
  What does "replace" have to do with it? Why do you invent the most illogical option possible - that I never uttered - to find a counter argument? Assuming that they ship another language in addition to Javascript would not be completely out of the question. While it seems that with WebAssembly that is no longer necessary, who knows what Mozilla, in search of future funding, may come up with to open new markets. They also tried creating their own OS for mobile - shipping Rust to further its adoption for whatever to me at the moment inconceivable reason is no less improbable. So yes, I wasn't sure what to expect from the headline - it said they are "shipping Rust" after all, so something crazy was certainly within realm of possibility.
  - kbenson 10y ago
    > While it seems that with WebAssembly that is no longer necessary I believe they have mentioned that a WebAssembly target for Rust compilation is something they are working towards, and IMO that would be the ideal way to deploy Rust for a website (if it's a compiled language, there's no need to deliver it uncompiled).
  - coltonv 10y ago
    Wow you took that joke way too seriously my friend.
- gkya 10y ago
  My first thought was that they'd include the compiler in Firefox, when I read the title.
unethical_ban 10y ago
Was it inconceivable for you, after reading the article, to understand what they meant? Is it so shocking a headline that multiple people have commented that "well REALLY it's just compiled code from Rust, not the runtime/source code/etc.". Which one of those possible interpretations makes the most sense? It's just shocking to me this type of meta-discussion about the phrasing of an announcement headline is the bulk of top comments.
- david-given 10y ago
  Don't underestimate just how easy it is to misunderstand phrases across cultures and languages. It took me, literally, years before I figured out 'check your brain at the door'.

Manishearth 10y ago

That is correct. "Shipping Rust code in Firefox" is what it's about. Though really "Shipping Rust in Firefox" means that too, it's just a bit ambiguous.

Noseshine 10y ago
I would expect the phrase "shipping Rust" to mean that they include the language environment, so that I can write code in Rust with Mozilla.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- wyager 10y ago
  That doesn't make sense. It is a statically compiled systems-oriented language, not a web-oriented language.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - maxerickson 10y ago
    The headline is nerdview. http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=26094 http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=26094
    - smt88 10y ago
      There is a whole article that explains the headline. The headline can't include 100% of background.
      - Noseshine 10y ago
        But a headline can be correct or incorrect. That they changed the headline shows a lot of users thought it was incorrect.
    - hyperpape 10y ago
      I'd say it's nerdview that's going to be read by nerds, and that unlike the examples in that lovely post, it will be understood by the majority of people who read it.
      - maxerickson 10y ago
        Sure, it wasn't egregious, but I think the insider perspective idea has lots of explanatory power when it comes to the confusion Noseshine expressed and the surprise wyager responded to the confusion with.
        hyperpape 10y ago
        Well, obviously we can disagree and I could be wrong, but I think Noseshine's response was a "man bites dog" situation. After thinking about it, I'd still expect the intended audience to see it.
        Noseshine 10y ago
        What does "man bites dog situation" mean? Looking at the Wikipedia explanation for the phrase in the context of journalism it supports my question about the title: Extreme and rare events are more likely to be reported. Obviously shipping "Rust code" is much less noteworthy than "shipping Rust" would be.
  - Noseshine 10y ago
    Of course it doesn't make sense. I'm talking about what the the headline says.
  - Sanddancer 10y ago
    Other browsers have support for statically compiled, safe, systems-oriented languages built in. https://developer.chrome.com/native-client https://developer.chrome.com/native-client
sctb 10y ago
Thanks, we updated the HN title to the much more unambiguous form.

awalGarg 10y ago

Sort of offtopic, but.. since Manish has already clarified the intent below... I am just curious - would you have drawn a similar conclusion from the headline if the language in question was not Rust, but a more popular/stable one, like say JavaScript/C? "Shipping C in Firefox"? (asking purely from a linguistic point of view)

frewsxcv 10y ago
What do you find unstable about Rust?
- awalGarg 10y ago
  Err, I didn't mean to say that Rust is unstable in the literal sense. Apologies! Just meant to highlight its "newness" in the given context (i.e., relative to other languages) :)

akerro 10y ago

You did not think, they would replace VanillaJS with Rust, did you? ;)

smt88 10y ago
This will happen. Rust can already be compiled to JS, although that's not very practical for client-side work right now. When WebAssembly is finished, stable, and widespread, I guarantee people will be using end-to-end Rust (among other languages).
Noseshine 10y ago
What does "replace" have to do with it? Why do you invent the most illogical option possible - that I never uttered - to find a counter argument? Assuming that they ship another language in addition to Javascript would not be completely out of the question. While it seems that with WebAssembly that is no longer necessary, who knows what Mozilla, in search of future funding, may come up with to open new markets. They also tried creating their own OS for mobile - shipping Rust to further its adoption for whatever to me at the moment inconceivable reason is no less improbable. So yes, I wasn't sure what to expect from the headline - it said they are "shipping Rust" after all, so something crazy was certainly within realm of possibility.
- kbenson 10y ago
  > While it seems that with WebAssembly that is no longer necessary I believe they have mentioned that a WebAssembly target for Rust compilation is something they are working towards, and IMO that would be the ideal way to deploy Rust for a website (if it's a compiled language, there's no need to deliver it uncompiled).
- coltonv 10y ago
  Wow you took that joke way too seriously my friend.
gkya 10y ago
My first thought was that they'd include the compiler in Firefox, when I read the title.

unethical_ban 10y ago

Was it inconceivable for you, after reading the article, to understand what they meant? Is it so shocking a headline that multiple people have commented that "well REALLY it's just compiled code from Rust, not the runtime/source code/etc.". Which one of those possible interpretations makes the most sense? It's just shocking to me this type of meta-discussion about the phrasing of an announcement headline is the bulk of top comments.

david-given 10y ago
Don't underestimate just how easy it is to misunderstand phrases across cultures and languages. It took me, literally, years before I figured out 'check your brain at the door'.