5 ms·

$70k is a splendid salary if you live outside the US :) It's probably more than I ever earned in my lifetime.

Dangeranger 10y ago
70k is a good salary even in many places within the US, the problem is that the cost of living in SF and NYC makes that salary very hard to live on. Rent in some locations within SF and NYC can meet or exceed 70k.
- kowdermeister 10y ago
  I get that, it's just so unreal to see these numbers for the same thing as I do. This is a really good reason why remote work is going to level the market. I'm a bit surprised that it's not already around 50% of hires.
  - branchless 10y ago
    Remote working on this scale in several major industries would precipitate a second banking crisis far larger than 2008 I suspect.
  - Dangeranger 10y ago
    What is considered 'good' compensation for a senior developer in Budapest? Have you been turned down for remote work due to where you live?
TrickzOnU 10y ago
Yes, i'd take a $70k salary while living in North Carolina. But the "shortage" being discussed here is for the Bay Area. I'm here, let me break down my costs: - $17k taxes - $3k health care premiums - $7k college loans - $36k rent - almost nothing left for savings, retirement, down payment, engagement ring, any means to get out of my situation
- macjohnmcc 10y ago
  You couldn't afford to get married if you can't afford an engagement ring.
  - thefastlane 10y ago
    not sure what you mean?
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
    - progressive_dad 10y ago
      I think I got the gist of OP's comment... Computer programmers make higher than the average salary. If you're barely making ends meet as a programmer your significant other is probably NOT making ends meet. Living together and sharing expenses saves some money but you'll probably be just about back where you started once you're married and co-habitating with your spouse. Then comes kids...
  - jajern 10y ago
    You can get married for about $60 (or the cost of a marriage license in your area). Of course, if you want a Wedding then that's a little different.
- bogomipz 10y ago
  Can I ask what 36K in rent affords and roughly which part of the Bar Area?
  - nedwin 10y ago
    $3k per month should get you a studio apartment in the Mission, SOMA, downtown etc. If you're willing to share you can get for cheaper. If you want 1 bedroom you're going to struggle to find something for $3k.
    - 10y ago
doozy 10y ago
It may be a splendid salary in some locations outside the US, it is not in many others. Americans tend to believe they are wealthier than anyone else. Not so! Apart of the fact several countries in Europe have higher salaries (and cost of living than the US) there's the fact major cities are much more expensive than smaller ones, even in poorer countries. Case in point: The most expensive cities in the Americas are Sao Paulo, Bogota and New York. You can easily enjoy a higher standard of living earning $70k in most of the US than you can in Sao Paulo or Bogota (I've lived in both, I know it for a fact)
- lohengramm 10y ago
  Just for the record: $70k is still an amazing salary for São Paulo. Actually, you can find good enough developers for half of that.
  - doozy 10y ago
    That's not the point, the point is $70k in Sao Paulo buys you a lower standard of living than $70k pretty much anywhere in the US but in a handful of cities. $70k in Sao Paulo doesn't go much further than $70k in New York (or Tokyo, London, Paris, Singapore...) Do I have to remind you how much a computer, a smartphone or a car costs in Brazil compared to the US? I doubt your claim of finding "good enough" developers for $35k. I was making more than that in my first job, fresh out of school, when I had zero real world experience, working remotely for an American company, and that was in the early 2000s. Most companies would be elated to find even a competent html/css/js coder for that price.
    - lohengramm 10y ago
      I understood your point about comparing São Paulo to other cities. I just wanted to point out that, in absolute terms (not relative to other ṕlaces), $70k is a great salary for SP standards. About the $35k claim, let's make the math: currently USD 35k ~= BRL 115k. 115k/12 ~= 9.6k. That means USD 35k/year is roughly BRL 9.6k/month, which is the salary of a Senior Java guy here. Idk about 2000, but it seems like you were doing very good back then.

70k is a good salary even in many places within the US, the problem is that the cost of living in SF and NYC makes that salary very hard to live on. Rent in some locations within SF and NYC can meet or exceed 70k.

kowdermeister 10y ago
I get that, it's just so unreal to see these numbers for the same thing as I do. This is a really good reason why remote work is going to level the market. I'm a bit surprised that it's not already around 50% of hires.
- branchless 10y ago
  Remote working on this scale in several major industries would precipitate a second banking crisis far larger than 2008 I suspect.
- Dangeranger 10y ago
  What is considered 'good' compensation for a senior developer in Budapest? Have you been turned down for remote work due to where you live?

TrickzOnU 10y ago

Yes, i'd take a $70k salary while living in North Carolina. But the "shortage" being discussed here is for the Bay Area. I'm here, let me break down my costs: - $17k taxes - $3k health care premiums - $7k college loans - $36k rent - almost nothing left for savings, retirement, down payment, engagement ring, any means to get out of my situation

macjohnmcc 10y ago
You couldn't afford to get married if you can't afford an engagement ring.
- thefastlane 10y ago
  not sure what you mean?
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - progressive_dad 10y ago
    I think I got the gist of OP's comment... Computer programmers make higher than the average salary. If you're barely making ends meet as a programmer your significant other is probably NOT making ends meet. Living together and sharing expenses saves some money but you'll probably be just about back where you started once you're married and co-habitating with your spouse. Then comes kids...
- jajern 10y ago
  You can get married for about $60 (or the cost of a marriage license in your area). Of course, if you want a Wedding then that's a little different.
bogomipz 10y ago
Can I ask what 36K in rent affords and roughly which part of the Bar Area?
- nedwin 10y ago
  $3k per month should get you a studio apartment in the Mission, SOMA, downtown etc. If you're willing to share you can get for cheaper. If you want 1 bedroom you're going to struggle to find something for $3k.
  - 10y ago

doozy 10y ago

It may be a splendid salary in some locations outside the US, it is not in many others. Americans tend to believe they are wealthier than anyone else. Not so! Apart of the fact several countries in Europe have higher salaries (and cost of living than the US) there's the fact major cities are much more expensive than smaller ones, even in poorer countries. Case in point: The most expensive cities in the Americas are Sao Paulo, Bogota and New York. You can easily enjoy a higher standard of living earning $70k in most of the US than you can in Sao Paulo or Bogota (I've lived in both, I know it for a fact)

lohengramm 10y ago
Just for the record: $70k is still an amazing salary for São Paulo. Actually, you can find good enough developers for half of that.
- doozy 10y ago
  That's not the point, the point is $70k in Sao Paulo buys you a lower standard of living than $70k pretty much anywhere in the US but in a handful of cities. $70k in Sao Paulo doesn't go much further than $70k in New York (or Tokyo, London, Paris, Singapore...) Do I have to remind you how much a computer, a smartphone or a car costs in Brazil compared to the US? I doubt your claim of finding "good enough" developers for $35k. I was making more than that in my first job, fresh out of school, when I had zero real world experience, working remotely for an American company, and that was in the early 2000s. Most companies would be elated to find even a competent html/css/js coder for that price.
  - lohengramm 10y ago
    I understood your point about comparing São Paulo to other cities. I just wanted to point out that, in absolute terms (not relative to other ṕlaces), $70k is a great salary for SP standards. About the $35k claim, let's make the math: currently USD 35k ~= BRL 115k. 115k/12 ~= 9.6k. That means USD 35k/year is roughly BRL 9.6k/month, which is the salary of a Senior Java guy here. Idk about 2000, but it seems like you were doing very good back then.