6 ms·

I've never been able to find an actual technical description of the hype-loop. Wasn't it downgraded to maglev at some point?

itake 10y ago
Elon Musk wrote a paper on it[0]. [0] http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/hyperloop_alpha.pdf http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/hyperloop_alpha.pdf
- Retric 10y ago
  Just to add a company took the name and is trying to build something else. https://hyperloop-one.com https://hyperloop-one.com. There has also been a lot of ideas on these lines. What made the original design different was low vaccume* which is vastly cheaper than high vaccume, and using the fan on front and ground effects to effectivly fly vs maglev or traditional rail. Note in this context high vaccume is hard, low vaccume is cheap. http://www.npl.co.uk/reference/faqs/what-do-high-vacuum-and-low-vacuum-mean-(faq-pressure) http://www.npl.co.uk/reference/faqs/what-do-high-vacuum-and-...
arcticfox 10y ago
The original announcement itselfwas a technical paper.
Animats 10y ago
The original air-supported Hyperloop concept, with clearances of a few millimeters between vehicle and tube, isn't looking good. The MIT prototype uses maglev suspension and more clearance, which is safer. Maglev in vacuum or near-vacuum is not a new idea; it's been discussed for decades. The question was always whether the vacuum tube was worth the trouble. The Shanghai airport maglev reaches 250 MPH right now in normal operation, and air resistance isn't the limiting factor on speed. The Japanese L0 Shinkansen reaches 375 MPH in tests, with an operational speed of 315 MPH. The main problem with maglev is that the track costs too much. The main claim for Hyperloop is that the tube is cheap. The original cost estimates assume using someone else's right of way and unreasonably cheap tunneling. Also, to get the straight right of way, the endpoints have to be somewhere inconvenient, well outside major urban areas.
- randartie 10y ago
  > the endpoints have to be somewhere inconvenient, well outside major urban areas. I imagine large urban areas will spring up around wherever a hyperloop endpoint is built. The builder might even be able to subsidize themselves by purchasing large radius of land around the endpoint prior to building it.
  - vegardx 10y ago
    I think you underestimate how long it takes to build a sizeable city, big enough to support having a hyperloop station or endpoint.
    - ZenoArrow 10y ago
      Depends on the circumstances. Sizeable cities have emerged at a rapid pace before. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhen https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhen http://www.newgeography.com/content/002862-the-evolving-urban-form-shenzhen http://www.newgeography.com/content/002862-the-evolving-urba...
      - vegardx 10y ago
        Yes, but you can agree that Shenzhen is a little different from a station at the endpoint of a hyperloop. To have a city grow more or less organically it's going to take a lot of time. It makes more economical sense to build a hyperloop between cities that already exist and can sustain it, than to think the world works like Transport Tycoon Deluxe.
      - rdiddly 10y ago
        Cities are like organisms, and as such, they only grow in the right "habitat" where conditions are right. Namely sites that are intrinsically important in some way, where there are numerous reasons for a city to be there. Proximity to transportation infrastructure is certainly one of the factors, but if that's all you have, lacking will be any of the others you'd find in a great city (most of which tend to be by-products of its having been there a long time, which usually means, maybe ironically, being near the transportation infrastructure we tend to associate with past centuries i.e. rivers, harbors). Result: You can't create a truly vibrant city in an arbitrary location. You might be able to manage a bedroom community or suburb though. An example like Shenzhen from a centrally-planned economy would tend to have limited applicability to the US, but this one is interesting because it's the exception that proves the rule. Shenzhen would've been an "important" place regardless, due to its being the first place in "mainland" China north of Hong Kong. Before 1980, the aforementioned central planning kept it from developing as fast as it probably would have otherwise. When they opened it for foreign investment, it took off like releasing a slingshot, hence the high growth rate.

itake 10y ago

Elon Musk wrote a paper on it[0]. [0] http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/hyperloop_alpha.pdf http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/hyperloop_alpha.pdf

Retric 10y ago
Just to add a company took the name and is trying to build something else. https://hyperloop-one.com https://hyperloop-one.com. There has also been a lot of ideas on these lines. What made the original design different was low vaccume* which is vastly cheaper than high vaccume, and using the fan on front and ground effects to effectivly fly vs maglev or traditional rail. Note in this context high vaccume is hard, low vaccume is cheap. http://www.npl.co.uk/reference/faqs/what-do-high-vacuum-and-low-vacuum-mean-(faq-pressure) http://www.npl.co.uk/reference/faqs/what-do-high-vacuum-and-...

arcticfox 10y ago

The original announcement itselfwas a technical paper.

Animats 10y ago

The original air-supported Hyperloop concept, with clearances of a few millimeters between vehicle and tube, isn't looking good. The MIT prototype uses maglev suspension and more clearance, which is safer. Maglev in vacuum or near-vacuum is not a new idea; it's been discussed for decades. The question was always whether the vacuum tube was worth the trouble. The Shanghai airport maglev reaches 250 MPH right now in normal operation, and air resistance isn't the limiting factor on speed. The Japanese L0 Shinkansen reaches 375 MPH in tests, with an operational speed of 315 MPH. The main problem with maglev is that the track costs too much. The main claim for Hyperloop is that the tube is cheap. The original cost estimates assume using someone else's right of way and unreasonably cheap tunneling. Also, to get the straight right of way, the endpoints have to be somewhere inconvenient, well outside major urban areas.

randartie 10y ago
> the endpoints have to be somewhere inconvenient, well outside major urban areas. I imagine large urban areas will spring up around wherever a hyperloop endpoint is built. The builder might even be able to subsidize themselves by purchasing large radius of land around the endpoint prior to building it.
- vegardx 10y ago
  I think you underestimate how long it takes to build a sizeable city, big enough to support having a hyperloop station or endpoint.
  - ZenoArrow 10y ago
    Depends on the circumstances. Sizeable cities have emerged at a rapid pace before. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhen https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhen http://www.newgeography.com/content/002862-the-evolving-urban-form-shenzhen http://www.newgeography.com/content/002862-the-evolving-urba...
    - vegardx 10y ago
      Yes, but you can agree that Shenzhen is a little different from a station at the endpoint of a hyperloop. To have a city grow more or less organically it's going to take a lot of time. It makes more economical sense to build a hyperloop between cities that already exist and can sustain it, than to think the world works like Transport Tycoon Deluxe.
    - rdiddly 10y ago
      Cities are like organisms, and as such, they only grow in the right "habitat" where conditions are right. Namely sites that are intrinsically important in some way, where there are numerous reasons for a city to be there. Proximity to transportation infrastructure is certainly one of the factors, but if that's all you have, lacking will be any of the others you'd find in a great city (most of which tend to be by-products of its having been there a long time, which usually means, maybe ironically, being near the transportation infrastructure we tend to associate with past centuries i.e. rivers, harbors). Result: You can't create a truly vibrant city in an arbitrary location. You might be able to manage a bedroom community or suburb though. An example like Shenzhen from a centrally-planned economy would tend to have limited applicability to the US, but this one is interesting because it's the exception that proves the rule. Shenzhen would've been an "important" place regardless, due to its being the first place in "mainland" China north of Hong Kong. Before 1980, the aforementioned central planning kept it from developing as fast as it probably would have otherwise. When they opened it for foreign investment, it took off like releasing a slingshot, hence the high growth rate.