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The reason Rhinos are being poached is the fact that its illegal to take their horns. They cannot farm Rhinos for horns so wild Rhinos end up being killed for i

The reason Rhinos are being poached is the fact that its illegal to take their horns. They cannot farm Rhinos for horns so wild Rhinos end up being killed for it. It is in fact possible to remove Rhino horns safely eithout killing the animal. This issue is another perfect example of people thousands of miles away detached being in an uproar with half assed solutions like "ban ivory" which exacerbate the problem.

zymhan 10y ago
> people thousands of miles away You read the part about the wildlife officials in African countries that support the ban, right?
- chrischen 10y ago
  I'm sure they have people on both sides, but they're just being used to legitimize the Western voices.
  - justinlardinois 10y ago
    People's opinions about their own countries "are just being used" to support foreign agendas?
    - nitrogen 10y ago
      Since this is about an EU decision, yes, that is exactly what is happening.
      - justinlardinois 10y ago
        You're making it sound like the EU is just deciding what's best for Africa, and the Africans in support are just yes men. In your worldview is it ever possible for a governing body to pass laws that have benefits in places outside its jurisdiction, without it being a unilateral decision imposed on them?
        sangnoir 10y ago
        > You're making it sound like the EU is just deciding what's best for Africa, and the Africans in support are just yes men. That is not the impression I got from OP. There are diverse African voices on the matter, and the Guardian is choosing which voices to amplify. Nothing surprising really, considering where the Guardian sits in the political spectrum.
    - sangnoir 10y ago
      > People's opinions about their own countries "are just being used" to support foreign agendas? Is this impossible to fathom? Are you assuming there is a unanimous African POV? I can assure you there isn't one. One of the 4 countries listed with expiring ivory embargoes (Zimbabwe) has an overpopulation(!)[0] of elephants and resorts to culling the herd annually[1]. Because of the embargo and culls, it has a large (and growing) ivory stockpile the country will be a able to sell soon; it makes sense that they would oppose a total ban. 0. A fact that is curiously missing from the article, which suggests either ignorance or bias. Much like the future: elephant extinction isn't uniformly distributed. 1. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/02/150206-elephant-conservation-zimbabwe-culling-animals/ http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/02/150206-eleph...
bronson 10y ago
Rhinos can't really be farmed. They have awful temperaments and require massive amounts of land. (...another perfect example of people thousands of miles away detached being in an uproar with half assed solutions like "farm rhinos" which exacerbate the problem...)
- chrischen 10y ago
  According to this VICE article, there are in reality a lot of rhino farms. They say there are simply more illegal poachers because the trade has been illegal for so long, and became dominated by criminals. Sort of like prohibition-era USA. http://motherboard.vice.com/read/rhino-horn-crisis-and-the-darknet http://motherboard.vice.com/read/rhino-horn-crisis-and-the-d...
  - bronson 10y ago
    You're right, there are a number of white rhino farms. It's the black rhino that's more farm-resistant. I hadn't realized the distinction, thanks. With enough money, anything can be farmed... But can that supply enough horn to solve poaching? (honest question, I can't find an authoritative answer)
zymhan 10y ago
Also > It is in fact possible to remove Rhino horns safely eithout killing the animal. What do you do with the Rhino once it's horn is gone? Are you going to raise it it's whole life to produce a few horns?
- seszett 10y ago
  That's what is happening no with poaching in any case. Rhinoceros horns actually grow back though, if the animal isn't killed of course. Apparently wild ones have to be de-horned every year or every other year so it must take a few years for them to grow a reasonable horn. Also rhinoceros meat is edible, so that's always something that can be done if it's more profitable than waiting for a new horn to grow.

zymhan 10y ago

> people thousands of miles away You read the part about the wildlife officials in African countries that support the ban, right?

chrischen 10y ago
I'm sure they have people on both sides, but they're just being used to legitimize the Western voices.
- justinlardinois 10y ago
  People's opinions about their own countries "are just being used" to support foreign agendas?
  - nitrogen 10y ago
    Since this is about an EU decision, yes, that is exactly what is happening.
    - justinlardinois 10y ago
      You're making it sound like the EU is just deciding what's best for Africa, and the Africans in support are just yes men. In your worldview is it ever possible for a governing body to pass laws that have benefits in places outside its jurisdiction, without it being a unilateral decision imposed on them?
      - sangnoir 10y ago
        > You're making it sound like the EU is just deciding what's best for Africa, and the Africans in support are just yes men. That is not the impression I got from OP. There are diverse African voices on the matter, and the Guardian is choosing which voices to amplify. Nothing surprising really, considering where the Guardian sits in the political spectrum.
  - sangnoir 10y ago
    > People's opinions about their own countries "are just being used" to support foreign agendas? Is this impossible to fathom? Are you assuming there is a unanimous African POV? I can assure you there isn't one. One of the 4 countries listed with expiring ivory embargoes (Zimbabwe) has an overpopulation(!)[0] of elephants and resorts to culling the herd annually[1]. Because of the embargo and culls, it has a large (and growing) ivory stockpile the country will be a able to sell soon; it makes sense that they would oppose a total ban. 0. A fact that is curiously missing from the article, which suggests either ignorance or bias. Much like the future: elephant extinction isn't uniformly distributed. 1. http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/02/150206-elephant-conservation-zimbabwe-culling-animals/ http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/02/150206-eleph...

bronson 10y ago

Rhinos can't really be farmed. They have awful temperaments and require massive amounts of land. (...another perfect example of people thousands of miles away detached being in an uproar with half assed solutions like "farm rhinos" which exacerbate the problem...)

chrischen 10y ago
According to this VICE article, there are in reality a lot of rhino farms. They say there are simply more illegal poachers because the trade has been illegal for so long, and became dominated by criminals. Sort of like prohibition-era USA. http://motherboard.vice.com/read/rhino-horn-crisis-and-the-darknet http://motherboard.vice.com/read/rhino-horn-crisis-and-the-d...
- bronson 10y ago
  You're right, there are a number of white rhino farms. It's the black rhino that's more farm-resistant. I hadn't realized the distinction, thanks. With enough money, anything can be farmed... But can that supply enough horn to solve poaching? (honest question, I can't find an authoritative answer)

zymhan 10y ago

Also > It is in fact possible to remove Rhino horns safely eithout killing the animal. What do you do with the Rhino once it's horn is gone? Are you going to raise it it's whole life to produce a few horns?

seszett 10y ago
That's what is happening no with poaching in any case. Rhinoceros horns actually grow back though, if the animal isn't killed of course. Apparently wild ones have to be de-horned every year or every other year so it must take a few years for them to grow a reasonable horn. Also rhinoceros meat is edible, so that's always something that can be done if it's more profitable than waiting for a new horn to grow.