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Any concession means that the driver somehow isn't ultimately responsible, which is a situation noone wants to end up in. It's also ridiculous.

semi-extrinsic 10y ago
Both Mercedes and Volvo have publicly stated they are taking full responsibility for any accidents which occur during use of their semi-autonomous systems. Tesla needs to step up, or it will hurt their public image.
- henrikschroder 10y ago
  That's probably very easy to say before you have a product on the market. Let's see if they change their tune afterwards. I also wonder if that would encourage more risky behaviour from users or less.
  - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
    Have you seen a 2016 Mercedes E-class? It has autonomous systems on essentially the same level as a Tesla, just without the flashy "Autopilot" branding. The new S-class coming out next year is going to have a lot more autonomous features on top of that, including Lidar (which Tesla lacks).
    - cynix 10y ago
      > on essentially the same level as a Tesla Actually, it appears to be nowhere near the level of a Tesla. http://mashable.com/2016/06/16/2017-mercedes-benz-e-class-first-drive/ http://mashable.com/2016/06/16/2017-mercedes-benz-e-class-fi...
      - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
        From the article you linked: > Turns out, the 2017 E-Class is just playing coy when it comes to self-driving capabilities. It is the first production car to receive an autonomous driving license in Nevada. So the technical system (hardware+software) is as good as or better than a Model S, but Mercedes believe it is irresponsible to call that Autopilot and pretend like the car is fully autonomous, so they've put in restrictions like requiring some tiny driver input once every 60 seconds so it knows you're paying attention.
    - henrikschroder 10y ago
      I think you mean the 2017 E-class, they just started appearing at dealers in CA, and I'm excited to go test-drive one and see how much better it is than my 2014 E-class. That said, it's my understanding that DISTRONIC still disengages if you take your hands off the wheel for more than a short amount of time, same as the 2014 model, and I haven't seen Mercedes make any announcement that the 2017 model will be so good that they're gonna assume liability for accidents. All bark, no bite. It's great that there's competition in the autonomous tech, but I'm very skeptical of either Mercedes or Volvo standing behind that promise any time soon now.
jayjay71 10y ago
While I agree there is a huge danger with semi-autonomous systems as drivers become disengaged, Volvo has already publicly announced they will take full legal responsibility for any crashes when their cars are in autonomous mode.
- henrikschroder 10y ago
  ...of which they have 0 on the market so far. Let's see how well that announcement holds up in the face of reality when they actually put cars on the market. It's a vaporware promise.
mamurphy 10y ago
I'm not so sure that the driver being 100% responsible is ridiculous with this particular iteration of technology. I have not experienced the Telsa system. However, IF the following from the blog post is true: >...Additionally, every time that Autopilot is engaged, the car reminds the driver to “Always keep your hands on the wheel. Be prepared to take over at any time.” The system also makes frequent checks to ensure that the driver's hands remain on the wheel and provides visual and audible alerts if hands-on is not detected. It then gradually slows down the car until hands-on is detected again. THEN, this seems a design that both envisions and forces a driver to keep their hands on the wheel and stay focused. This does not seem to be a design that directs, encourages, or allows a driver to engage the system then take a nap. At some point in the future, with fully autonomous driving, yes, there must be some legal framework wherein the car manufacturer is responsible. This piece of technology does not seem to fall within that framework.

semi-extrinsic 10y ago

Both Mercedes and Volvo have publicly stated they are taking full responsibility for any accidents which occur during use of their semi-autonomous systems. Tesla needs to step up, or it will hurt their public image.

henrikschroder 10y ago
That's probably very easy to say before you have a product on the market. Let's see if they change their tune afterwards. I also wonder if that would encourage more risky behaviour from users or less.
- semi-extrinsic 10y ago
  Have you seen a 2016 Mercedes E-class? It has autonomous systems on essentially the same level as a Tesla, just without the flashy "Autopilot" branding. The new S-class coming out next year is going to have a lot more autonomous features on top of that, including Lidar (which Tesla lacks).
  - cynix 10y ago
    > on essentially the same level as a Tesla Actually, it appears to be nowhere near the level of a Tesla. http://mashable.com/2016/06/16/2017-mercedes-benz-e-class-first-drive/ http://mashable.com/2016/06/16/2017-mercedes-benz-e-class-fi...
    - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
      From the article you linked: > Turns out, the 2017 E-Class is just playing coy when it comes to self-driving capabilities. It is the first production car to receive an autonomous driving license in Nevada. So the technical system (hardware+software) is as good as or better than a Model S, but Mercedes believe it is irresponsible to call that Autopilot and pretend like the car is fully autonomous, so they've put in restrictions like requiring some tiny driver input once every 60 seconds so it knows you're paying attention.
  - henrikschroder 10y ago
    I think you mean the 2017 E-class, they just started appearing at dealers in CA, and I'm excited to go test-drive one and see how much better it is than my 2014 E-class. That said, it's my understanding that DISTRONIC still disengages if you take your hands off the wheel for more than a short amount of time, same as the 2014 model, and I haven't seen Mercedes make any announcement that the 2017 model will be so good that they're gonna assume liability for accidents. All bark, no bite. It's great that there's competition in the autonomous tech, but I'm very skeptical of either Mercedes or Volvo standing behind that promise any time soon now.

jayjay71 10y ago

While I agree there is a huge danger with semi-autonomous systems as drivers become disengaged, Volvo has already publicly announced they will take full legal responsibility for any crashes when their cars are in autonomous mode.

henrikschroder 10y ago
...of which they have 0 on the market so far. Let's see how well that announcement holds up in the face of reality when they actually put cars on the market. It's a vaporware promise.

mamurphy 10y ago

I'm not so sure that the driver being 100% responsible is ridiculous with this particular iteration of technology. I have not experienced the Telsa system. However, IF the following from the blog post is true: >...Additionally, every time that Autopilot is engaged, the car reminds the driver to “Always keep your hands on the wheel. Be prepared to take over at any time.” The system also makes frequent checks to ensure that the driver's hands remain on the wheel and provides visual and audible alerts if hands-on is not detected. It then gradually slows down the car until hands-on is detected again. THEN, this seems a design that both envisions and forces a driver to keep their hands on the wheel and stay focused. This does not seem to be a design that directs, encourages, or allows a driver to engage the system then take a nap. At some point in the future, with fully autonomous driving, yes, there must be some legal framework wherein the car manufacturer is responsible. This piece of technology does not seem to fall within that framework.