5 ms·

This response is right on the money. I'd just like to add that almost all the problems with malicious ads are caused by ad networks that are used as "backfills

by zapt02 10y ago

This response is right on the money. I'd just like to add that almost all the problems with malicious ads are caused by ad networks that are used as "backfills" for when the in-house ads aren't booked. Backfilled ads are not inspected and can contain everything, but they are also needed because otherwise you'll have unsold inventory.

CyberDildonics 10y ago
One thing that is starting to become more common knowledge is that ad space is a commodity. Typically commodities are auctioned or sold on exchanges. I would think it should be entirely possible to not have any backfill by having the prices for ad impressions fluctuate on an exchange (I realize ad exchanges already exist, it seems they just need to make it into these situations).
- madeofpalk 10y ago
  Exchanges are these backfills. When we don't have a big sponsor for a section of our site, or haven't had enough direct sales for certain placements, it goes out to the ad exchange to action the spot off. That's where the problem is. That's somewhere we could start enforcing certain quality.
  - zapt02 10y ago
    Exactly! Larger ad inventory purchases are still largely sold by salespeople with written contracts. Ad exchanges and real-time bidding (RTB) are only causing a problem for people working in the media space because on the one hand if you don't have them you lose money, but on the other hand it's like gambling in regards to the quality of ads that will be served.
a3n 10y ago
Are there salespeople in this area anymore, or is it all automatic? Shouldn't the salespeople be working harder to sell unsold inventory?
- madeofpalk 10y ago
  Of course there are salespeople. When the country's leading air freshener brand wants to buy out all premium ad placements for a section of a website as a part of an integrated tv/online/outdoors campaign, they're going to want a salesperson to work things out with.
  - a3n 10y ago
    And yet an excuse is auctioning unsold inventory to unsavory networks. If I was buying a box of cereal, "we couldn't source enough reputable corn, so we topped it with melamine" would be the death of that cereal, for me. (And yes, this is buyers at the cereal company instead of ad sellers, but it's the same: the hypothetical cereal company was not able to "sell" enough of its money to corn suppliers.)
    - madeofpalk 10y ago
      But yet as a developer "i don't write good enough code, so we have a massive test harness to catch any bugs I might introduce". Of course the goal is to operate at 100% efficiency, but in reality that's not going to happen all the time. Backfill channels like this are a way to make at least a little bit of money when sales a slow for a bit for whatever reason. In terms of the problems the online media industry faces with advertising, the efficiency of in-house sales teams is not a huge priority atm.
      - a3n 10y ago
        And so I block. :)
tluyben2 10y ago
I am wondering how much $ those backfilled ads make though? In my (limited) experience they are really not worth the hassle even on high traffic sites. We resorted to just showing special deals of our own product in unsold inventory spots.

by zapt02 10y ago

CyberDildonics 10y ago

One thing that is starting to become more common knowledge is that ad space is a commodity. Typically commodities are auctioned or sold on exchanges. I would think it should be entirely possible to not have any backfill by having the prices for ad impressions fluctuate on an exchange (I realize ad exchanges already exist, it seems they just need to make it into these situations).

madeofpalk 10y ago
Exchanges are these backfills. When we don't have a big sponsor for a section of our site, or haven't had enough direct sales for certain placements, it goes out to the ad exchange to action the spot off. That's where the problem is. That's somewhere we could start enforcing certain quality.
- zapt02 10y ago
  Exactly! Larger ad inventory purchases are still largely sold by salespeople with written contracts. Ad exchanges and real-time bidding (RTB) are only causing a problem for people working in the media space because on the one hand if you don't have them you lose money, but on the other hand it's like gambling in regards to the quality of ads that will be served.

a3n 10y ago

Are there salespeople in this area anymore, or is it all automatic? Shouldn't the salespeople be working harder to sell unsold inventory?

madeofpalk 10y ago
Of course there are salespeople. When the country's leading air freshener brand wants to buy out all premium ad placements for a section of a website as a part of an integrated tv/online/outdoors campaign, they're going to want a salesperson to work things out with.
- a3n 10y ago
  And yet an excuse is auctioning unsold inventory to unsavory networks. If I was buying a box of cereal, "we couldn't source enough reputable corn, so we topped it with melamine" would be the death of that cereal, for me. (And yes, this is buyers at the cereal company instead of ad sellers, but it's the same: the hypothetical cereal company was not able to "sell" enough of its money to corn suppliers.)
  - madeofpalk 10y ago
    But yet as a developer "i don't write good enough code, so we have a massive test harness to catch any bugs I might introduce". Of course the goal is to operate at 100% efficiency, but in reality that's not going to happen all the time. Backfill channels like this are a way to make at least a little bit of money when sales a slow for a bit for whatever reason. In terms of the problems the online media industry faces with advertising, the efficiency of in-house sales teams is not a huge priority atm.
    - a3n 10y ago
      And so I block. :)

tluyben2 10y ago

I am wondering how much $ those backfilled ads make though? In my (limited) experience they are really not worth the hassle even on high traffic sites. We resorted to just showing special deals of our own product in unsold inventory spots.