7 ms·

I would argue that people with those crazy LED headlights are even worse. Since I often work late, I get the pleasure of being temporarily blinded as a white dw

I would argue that people with those crazy LED headlights are even worse. Since I often work late, I get the pleasure of being temporarily blinded as a white dwarf passes by at 45mph regularly.

protomyth 10y ago
They are a tad bit intense but they really save your bacon when there are deer in the ditches. I do wish there was a middle ground.
mangeletti 10y ago
I literally LOL @ "white dwarf". I absolutely agree, but, I have to admit... I have those lights :/ My last car was smashed by an idiot who didn't know how to back out of a parking spot, so rather than waiting for weeks while the body shop replaced the whole right side my car, I just traded it in for a new lease; a 2016 of same model. The new model has those stupid lights and I absolutely hate them. They're even unnatural and obnoxious to the person driving the car, not just the poor souls they're blinding. Unfortunately, most cars will likely have them within the next few years.
steveax 10y ago
And don't even get me started on the LED eye melters that cyclists are running these days. Some are about as bright as car headlights, but the spread and aim are inferior - especially since the folks that run those invariably seem to point them up from the horizontal. I keep thinking about mounting a 8 D cell maglight on a gimbal on my handlebars to give them a photon in-kind response.
- beedogs 10y ago
  Just get a green laser and mess with the optics on it so there's a bit more beam spread at longer distances.
- NegativeLatency 10y ago
  I think part of it is a reaction to the poor bicycle infrastructure in many cities. Bright lights have stopped cars from hitting me at night a couple of times. While I'm simpathetic to other people (I try not to point them in people's eyes) there aren't that many other options.
  - steveax 10y ago
    I live in Portland, OR, e have pretty good bike infrastructure. If the goal is to be seen, there are indeed other options. LED glow or area lights are probably more effective than the eye melters pointing towards the sky and much less hostile.
    - frabbit 10y ago
      > LED glow or area lights are probably more effective Based on what?
      - steveax 10y ago
        Color other than white, large area illuminated, can be seen from any direction. All these contribute.
- sgarman 10y ago
  If you see the biker then I think the lights did a good job. I suppose you could make an argument that it could blind people and they hit someone/something but I never heard of that happing - I only hear bikers getting hit because they were not seen.
  - djeikyb 10y ago
    i'm a cyclist and i sometimes have to stop and get off my bike and wait for an oncoming cyclist to pass me (eg, on a multipath). it's not necessarily the brightness, it's that it's not constructed to be visible (and/or illuminate the road) without also blinding oncoming traffic. fortunately i haven't ever hit someone or something while blinded by an oncoming cyclist, but that's in spite of the crap bike light, not because it did a good job.
    - steveax 10y ago
      Yes, me too. I'm a daily bike commuter and am quite sympathetic to the being seen aspect. This goes way beyond that in some cases. Case in point: a good chunk of my ride goes through the Portland Springwater corridor. This is a dedicated bike/pedestrian path. Much of it is unlit at night. I've seen these riders a half mile ago (~2 minutes) and by the time we're getting close enough to matter their lights are blinding. It's like a driver who refuses to dim their high beams for oncoming traffic.
  - Mithaldu 10y ago
    > the lights did a good job No, absolutely not. Lights are to help the cyclist SEE. To be SEEN you need reflectors. [1] Worse, if a cyclist's frontlight is blinding other cyclists coming at him it means they're failing both the others AND themselves, as: The oncoming ones can't see shit and are more likely to make a mistake and the rider themselves isn't illuminating the ground ahead of them so they can't actually see where they're going. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfWzeGlaFvI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfWzeGlaFvI
- api_or_ipa 10y ago
  As a cyclist commuter who was hit by a clearly negligent car driver on Sunday in broad daylight, I fully support any measure to make bicyclists more noticed on the streets. In the absence of fully grade separated bike lanes, bicycles can only do so much to protect themselves against 4,000lbs of metal.
  - loco5niner 10y ago
    That's an unfortunately ironic response to a comment that basically says "I'm getting blinded by these bicyclists headlights".
- 5555624 10y ago
  More often than not, they're not mounted correctly. When it comes to headlights, too many cyclists (most?) do not think of their bike as a vehicle. The headlight should be a solid light and the light beam should not be parallel to the ground. the primary purpose of your headlight is there to help you see where you're going. If it's not, you don't really ride in the dark. As with any other vehicle, being seen is a secondary reason for lights. I've been commuting by bike, year-round, for 17 years. While my commute home may require lights, my morning commute requires them. (It's at 3:00 a.m. and some stretches have no lights.) If my headlight was parallel to the ground, it would not let me see where I am going. Oh, it will show a person or vehicle, but it won't let me see the road. It's aimed at a spot X feet in front of me, enabling me to see debris on the road, as well as anything huge. Properly aimed or not, a headlight is only going to let a motorist (or anyone) see you if they are coming towards you. I can see them coming, too. A good reflective vest and secondary lights (helmet, side, etc.) is necessary to let people see you from behind or the side. (The vest is useless if the car is running without its headlights on, which has happened to me a few times in the morning.)
  - frabbit 10y ago
    > the primary purpose of your headlight is there to help you see where you're going. Sorry. Didn't see you.
    - 5555624 10y ago
      If you were coming towards me, why were you in the wrong lane? If you were drunk or not paying attention, seeing me probably wouldn't make a difference. If you were coming from behind me, you wouldn't have seen my headlight, anyway. That's why I have a taillight and a reflective vest.
rando18423 10y ago
I'm not sure how these are legal, I'm in my twenties with 20/20 and only somewhat sensitive to light but even the normal ones are absolutely blinding to the point where I'm really not sure what I would do (other than have already crashed) without the "focus on the white line to the right" trick.
jhayward 10y ago
Most of the offending lights, as far as I know, are badly done retrofit kits that don't have the proper focusing hardware. Owners and cheap shops just drop an LED replacement into a "standard" headlight reflector and get horrible results. The proper ones, like one sees on BMW, etc., don't blind people.
mapt 10y ago
There's no law or technical consideration that says "LED headlights have to be built 10x brighter". People want them as bright as their electrical system can handle, and they buy them that bright. Blame people. If you like, regulate people; We successfully prevent them from using green lasers as headlights, this should be no different.

I would argue that people with those crazy LED headlights are even worse. Since I often work late, I get the pleasure of being temporarily blinded as a white dwarf passes by at 45mph regularly.

protomyth 10y ago

They are a tad bit intense but they really save your bacon when there are deer in the ditches. I do wish there was a middle ground.

mangeletti 10y ago

I literally LOL @ "white dwarf". I absolutely agree, but, I have to admit... I have those lights :/ My last car was smashed by an idiot who didn't know how to back out of a parking spot, so rather than waiting for weeks while the body shop replaced the whole right side my car, I just traded it in for a new lease; a 2016 of same model. The new model has those stupid lights and I absolutely hate them. They're even unnatural and obnoxious to the person driving the car, not just the poor souls they're blinding. Unfortunately, most cars will likely have them within the next few years.

steveax 10y ago

And don't even get me started on the LED eye melters that cyclists are running these days. Some are about as bright as car headlights, but the spread and aim are inferior - especially since the folks that run those invariably seem to point them up from the horizontal. I keep thinking about mounting a 8 D cell maglight on a gimbal on my handlebars to give them a photon in-kind response.

beedogs 10y ago
Just get a green laser and mess with the optics on it so there's a bit more beam spread at longer distances.
NegativeLatency 10y ago
I think part of it is a reaction to the poor bicycle infrastructure in many cities. Bright lights have stopped cars from hitting me at night a couple of times. While I'm simpathetic to other people (I try not to point them in people's eyes) there aren't that many other options.
- steveax 10y ago
  I live in Portland, OR, e have pretty good bike infrastructure. If the goal is to be seen, there are indeed other options. LED glow or area lights are probably more effective than the eye melters pointing towards the sky and much less hostile.
  - frabbit 10y ago
    > LED glow or area lights are probably more effective Based on what?
    - steveax 10y ago
      Color other than white, large area illuminated, can be seen from any direction. All these contribute.
sgarman 10y ago
If you see the biker then I think the lights did a good job. I suppose you could make an argument that it could blind people and they hit someone/something but I never heard of that happing - I only hear bikers getting hit because they were not seen.
- djeikyb 10y ago
  i'm a cyclist and i sometimes have to stop and get off my bike and wait for an oncoming cyclist to pass me (eg, on a multipath). it's not necessarily the brightness, it's that it's not constructed to be visible (and/or illuminate the road) without also blinding oncoming traffic. fortunately i haven't ever hit someone or something while blinded by an oncoming cyclist, but that's in spite of the crap bike light, not because it did a good job.
  - steveax 10y ago
    Yes, me too. I'm a daily bike commuter and am quite sympathetic to the being seen aspect. This goes way beyond that in some cases. Case in point: a good chunk of my ride goes through the Portland Springwater corridor. This is a dedicated bike/pedestrian path. Much of it is unlit at night. I've seen these riders a half mile ago (~2 minutes) and by the time we're getting close enough to matter their lights are blinding. It's like a driver who refuses to dim their high beams for oncoming traffic.
- Mithaldu 10y ago
  > the lights did a good job No, absolutely not. Lights are to help the cyclist SEE. To be SEEN you need reflectors. [1] Worse, if a cyclist's frontlight is blinding other cyclists coming at him it means they're failing both the others AND themselves, as: The oncoming ones can't see shit and are more likely to make a mistake and the rider themselves isn't illuminating the ground ahead of them so they can't actually see where they're going. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfWzeGlaFvI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfWzeGlaFvI
api_or_ipa 10y ago
As a cyclist commuter who was hit by a clearly negligent car driver on Sunday in broad daylight, I fully support any measure to make bicyclists more noticed on the streets. In the absence of fully grade separated bike lanes, bicycles can only do so much to protect themselves against 4,000lbs of metal.
- loco5niner 10y ago
  That's an unfortunately ironic response to a comment that basically says "I'm getting blinded by these bicyclists headlights".
5555624 10y ago
More often than not, they're not mounted correctly. When it comes to headlights, too many cyclists (most?) do not think of their bike as a vehicle. The headlight should be a solid light and the light beam should not be parallel to the ground. the primary purpose of your headlight is there to help you see where you're going. If it's not, you don't really ride in the dark. As with any other vehicle, being seen is a secondary reason for lights. I've been commuting by bike, year-round, for 17 years. While my commute home may require lights, my morning commute requires them. (It's at 3:00 a.m. and some stretches have no lights.) If my headlight was parallel to the ground, it would not let me see where I am going. Oh, it will show a person or vehicle, but it won't let me see the road. It's aimed at a spot X feet in front of me, enabling me to see debris on the road, as well as anything huge. Properly aimed or not, a headlight is only going to let a motorist (or anyone) see you if they are coming towards you. I can see them coming, too. A good reflective vest and secondary lights (helmet, side, etc.) is necessary to let people see you from behind or the side. (The vest is useless if the car is running without its headlights on, which has happened to me a few times in the morning.)
- frabbit 10y ago
  > the primary purpose of your headlight is there to help you see where you're going. Sorry. Didn't see you.
  - 5555624 10y ago
    If you were coming towards me, why were you in the wrong lane? If you were drunk or not paying attention, seeing me probably wouldn't make a difference. If you were coming from behind me, you wouldn't have seen my headlight, anyway. That's why I have a taillight and a reflective vest.

rando18423 10y ago

I'm not sure how these are legal, I'm in my twenties with 20/20 and only somewhat sensitive to light but even the normal ones are absolutely blinding to the point where I'm really not sure what I would do (other than have already crashed) without the "focus on the white line to the right" trick.

jhayward 10y ago

Most of the offending lights, as far as I know, are badly done retrofit kits that don't have the proper focusing hardware. Owners and cheap shops just drop an LED replacement into a "standard" headlight reflector and get horrible results. The proper ones, like one sees on BMW, etc., don't blind people.

mapt 10y ago

There's no law or technical consideration that says "LED headlights have to be built 10x brighter". People want them as bright as their electrical system can handle, and they buy them that bright. Blame people. If you like, regulate people; We successfully prevent them from using green lasers as headlights, this should be no different.