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As someone who (after considerable deliberation) voted to Remain, and now feels that my country is being dragged to the edge of a very high precipice, this make

As someone who (after considerable deliberation) voted to Remain, and now feels that my country is being dragged to the edge of a very high precipice, this makes for interesting reading. I sincerely hope that there will be an (unexpected) upside to leaving the EU, but I think that is a forlorn hope. Most of the people I have spoken to about it who voted to Leave have done so on the most narrow-minded of reasons - typically either "stop immigration" or "take our country back" - both of which are definitely in the "old view" of the world in this article. No-one I know of who voted Leave gave even a moment's thought to the immense amount of work needed to unpick 40 years of integration; to the practicalities of it that will mean it will be the work of Parliament for years to come to simply get to the point where we are today. I am someone who had severe reservations about the European project (i.e. the development into a plan for a superstate, rather than the originally presented idea of a common market), so I really hope that the information in this article turns out to be true, and that somehow the knuckle-dragging imbeciles that I saw on the news last night (Canvey Island piece, if anyone watched it?) have somehow created a masterstroke in political maneuvering which will at least give my step-kids a stab at a decent future. I know none of them think that is the case at the moment.

7952 10y ago
Surely the easiest solution is to simply retain most EU law and regulation as they are intact. Government would then have the oppurtunity to weaken, or even strengthen those laws and regulations in the future. Suddenly abandoning things like product safety standards or environmental protection could be hugely contentious and not actually neccessary to appease the Brexit voters. The race to the bottom can happen after future elections where government can make promises.
- tonyedgecombe 10y ago
  A lot of those laws came from the UK in the first place, this is the least of our problems.
_puk 10y ago
The UK has always had the "islander mentality". The development of a European Superstate would either have had to drag the UK along unwillingly (barring apathy), or happen without them. The positive I am taking from it all is the fact that for once people are actually talking politics again. The next general election won't be as apathetic as the last few, which is likely why Boris won't call one if he becomes leader of the party. This article pictures a gig economy built upon a universal income as a pre-requisite, which I just don't see happening. Given the current state welfare system, there is potential for something like this to be gradually introduced, such that those on lower/no income could start building the gig industry on top of any basic state benefits (as opposed to earn a pound, lose a pound in benefits). That would require a huge shift in current mentalities though, possibly greater than the admission that maybe we would be better off as an integral part of any EU superstate.
- tonyedgecombe 10y ago
  If Labour don't sort themselves out expect an election pretty quickly.
tim333 10y ago
I just watched the Canvey piece I think http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36646709 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36646709 They seem quite sophisticated compared to the voters in Merthyr Tydfil https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCP0R3Z6T58&feature=youtu.be&t=2m9s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCP0R3Z6T58&feature=youtu.be... That said I don't think anyone including the PM or the Brexit leaders really thought it through. This from the Economist: >IT WAS a troubling exchange. On live television Faisal Islam, the political editor of SkyNews, was recounting a conversation with a pro-Brexit Conservative MP. “I said to him: ‘Where’s the plan? Can we see the Brexit plan now?’ [The MP replied:] ‘There is no plan. The Leave campaign don’t have a post-Brexit plan…Number 10 should have had a plan.’” The camera cut to Anna Botting, the anchor, horror chasing across her face. For a couple of seconds they were both silent, as the point sunk in. “Don’t know what to say to that, actually,” she replied, looking down at the desk. Then she cut to a commercial break. ... >As Mr Cameron reportedly told aides on June 24th when explaining his decision to resign: “Why should I do all the hard shit?”
sevenless 10y ago
Posting this in the faint hope you will see it. A post you wrote a few months ago made me think you would be eligible to participate in this survey. I feel there's a serious social issue that researchers need to catch up to. https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/SCX9RZY https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/SCX9RZY

7952 10y ago

Surely the easiest solution is to simply retain most EU law and regulation as they are intact. Government would then have the oppurtunity to weaken, or even strengthen those laws and regulations in the future. Suddenly abandoning things like product safety standards or environmental protection could be hugely contentious and not actually neccessary to appease the Brexit voters. The race to the bottom can happen after future elections where government can make promises.

tonyedgecombe 10y ago
A lot of those laws came from the UK in the first place, this is the least of our problems.

_puk 10y ago

The UK has always had the "islander mentality". The development of a European Superstate would either have had to drag the UK along unwillingly (barring apathy), or happen without them. The positive I am taking from it all is the fact that for once people are actually talking politics again. The next general election won't be as apathetic as the last few, which is likely why Boris won't call one if he becomes leader of the party. This article pictures a gig economy built upon a universal income as a pre-requisite, which I just don't see happening. Given the current state welfare system, there is potential for something like this to be gradually introduced, such that those on lower/no income could start building the gig industry on top of any basic state benefits (as opposed to earn a pound, lose a pound in benefits). That would require a huge shift in current mentalities though, possibly greater than the admission that maybe we would be better off as an integral part of any EU superstate.

tonyedgecombe 10y ago
If Labour don't sort themselves out expect an election pretty quickly.

tim333 10y ago

I just watched the Canvey piece I think http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36646709 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36646709 They seem quite sophisticated compared to the voters in Merthyr Tydfil https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCP0R3Z6T58&feature=youtu.be&t=2m9s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCP0R3Z6T58&feature=youtu.be... That said I don't think anyone including the PM or the Brexit leaders really thought it through. This from the Economist: >IT WAS a troubling exchange. On live television Faisal Islam, the political editor of SkyNews, was recounting a conversation with a pro-Brexit Conservative MP. “I said to him: ‘Where’s the plan? Can we see the Brexit plan now?’ [The MP replied:] ‘There is no plan. The Leave campaign don’t have a post-Brexit plan…Number 10 should have had a plan.’” The camera cut to Anna Botting, the anchor, horror chasing across her face. For a couple of seconds they were both silent, as the point sunk in. “Don’t know what to say to that, actually,” she replied, looking down at the desk. Then she cut to a commercial break. ... >As Mr Cameron reportedly told aides on June 24th when explaining his decision to resign: “Why should I do all the hard shit?”

sevenless 10y ago

Posting this in the faint hope you will see it. A post you wrote a few months ago made me think you would be eligible to participate in this survey. I feel there's a serious social issue that researchers need to catch up to. https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/SCX9RZY https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/SCX9RZY