4 ms·

I wouldn't be upset if Windows 10 hadn't turned into a telemetry botnet for Microsoft. Edit: I see in other posts accusations of paranoia. But how can I not be

I wouldn't be upset if Windows 10 hadn't turned into a telemetry botnet for Microsoft. Edit: I see in other posts accusations of paranoia. But how can I not be paranoid when I cannot determine what is being transmitted.

FussyZeus 10y ago
^ This. It's not THAT there is telemetry and "phoning home," it's the fact that Microsoft flat out REFUSES to be up front about what it's sending home, how they're anonymizing it, and why these things can't be 100% disabled. If you say nothing then your users will (and should) assume the worst.
- 794CD01 10y ago
  Where have they refused to be up front about any of this? As far as I'm aware, they have detailed all of those things except how exactly they anonymize the data, which I haven't seen anyone specifically ask them about.
  - FussyZeus 10y ago
    There's no way to turn it off. It says it's turned off, and it's still sending shit to Redmond. That's unacceptable and deceptive. I do not use software that lies to me, period, paragraph.
    - AdmiralAsshat 10y ago
      I suggest you check out Spybot Anti-Beacon. It will help you in turning some of those Telemetry services off. https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/ https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/
    - 794CD01 10y ago
      You can turn it off via group policy if you have windows enterprise. If you just want to complain that the cheaper version doesn't have the feature you want, and you don't want to pay the higher price for the version that does have it, that's your right, but I don't have much sympathy for that.
      - nitrogen 10y ago
        Another sad example of pirates having it better than us legitimate users.
      - FussyZeus 10y ago
        I have to pay to not be spied on? And you think that's acceptable?
        seanp2k2 10y ago
        You have to pay to have the option to not be spied on, because only the version designed to be used for serious business supports disabling the first-party tracking, because business users are important and home users are just another revenue channel. I now have even less moral issue with not paying to use Windows for personal use. Seriously, they should have just made it free for home users regardless of Win7 license state (I've had terrible luck with "upgraded" versions of Windows -- clean installs only for me, and yes I know about the Insider program and the exception to this...I didn't stay up on the news and I missed the "must be installed by" deadline).
        FussyZeus 10y ago
        If it makes you feel better, my mother was on an insider build because we figured she would get Windows either free or at a discount, and she ended up having to buy retail anyway.
        794CD01 10y ago
        You have to pay for Windows just like any other software the creators don't want to give away for free.
        FussyZeus 10y ago
        This point fails thrice: - I am paying for Windows already, that we've established does spy on me - The Enterprise edition is not available to be purchased by a regular consumer anywhere I can locate - The Enterprise edition doesn't allow the disabling of ALL reporting to Redmond, only most, and only via group policy which is hardly accessible to the layman.
  - curt15 10y ago
    Where does Microsoft explain what they are sending to domains like ad.doubleclick.net?
    - 794CD01 10y ago
      Exactly where you would expect to find it: the data use and access section of the technet article on the feature, and in the Windows privacy statement.
GrumpyYoungMan 10y ago
I take it that you don't use a smartphone, either, since you have no way of knowing what is transmitted either, either by the primary OS or the secondary radio OS. http://www.osnews.com/story/27416/The_second_operating_system_hiding_in_every_mobile_phone http://www.osnews.com/story/27416/The_second_operating_syste... Or macOS (nee OS X), since Apple gathers telemetry as well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11907060 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11907060 Moreover, security researchers looking to make a name for themselves are crawling all over Windows. If they haven't found anything in the telemetry that makes headlines yet, most likely there's nothing to find. Paranoid or not, telemetry is already everywhere without you knowing what's being sent and it's here to stay. Singling out Windows is ridiculous.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- vetinari 10y ago
  > I take it that you don't use a smartphone, either, since you have no way of knowing what is transmitted either, either by the primary OS or the secondary radio OS. You know, two wrongs do not make one right. > Or macOS (nee OS X), since Apple gathers telemetry as well. In OSX, sending telemetry and crash reports is voluntary. It is being asked in the OOB wizard and is easily available in the Settings application. In consumer SKUs of Windows 10, that's not the case, sending telemetry is mandatory. > Paranoid or not, telemetry is already everywhere without you knowing what's being sent and it's here to stay. Too early to say. It may also break Microsoft's neck. > Singling out Windows is ridiculous. Biggest target. They have a great opportunity to lead by example - in the positive way.
- whyoh 10y ago
  >If they haven't found anything in the telemetry that makes headlines yet, most likely there's nothing to find. There's plenty to be found and Microsoft isn't even hiding it: https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/manage/configure-windows-telemetry-in-your-organization https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/manage/con... That data, even at the "Basic" level, is enough to be used for 'bad things'. And since it's on someone else's computer you can't know who has access to it, so you can assume the worst. >Singling out Windows is ridiculous. Just Windows 10. Because it's the only mainstream desktop OS with forced telemetry and no opt-out option.

FussyZeus 10y ago

^ This. It's not THAT there is telemetry and "phoning home," it's the fact that Microsoft flat out REFUSES to be up front about what it's sending home, how they're anonymizing it, and why these things can't be 100% disabled. If you say nothing then your users will (and should) assume the worst.

794CD01 10y ago
Where have they refused to be up front about any of this? As far as I'm aware, they have detailed all of those things except how exactly they anonymize the data, which I haven't seen anyone specifically ask them about.
- FussyZeus 10y ago
  There's no way to turn it off. It says it's turned off, and it's still sending shit to Redmond. That's unacceptable and deceptive. I do not use software that lies to me, period, paragraph.
  - AdmiralAsshat 10y ago
    I suggest you check out Spybot Anti-Beacon. It will help you in turning some of those Telemetry services off. https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/ https://www.safer-networking.org/spybot-anti-beacon/
  - 794CD01 10y ago
    You can turn it off via group policy if you have windows enterprise. If you just want to complain that the cheaper version doesn't have the feature you want, and you don't want to pay the higher price for the version that does have it, that's your right, but I don't have much sympathy for that.
    - nitrogen 10y ago
      Another sad example of pirates having it better than us legitimate users.
    - FussyZeus 10y ago
      I have to pay to not be spied on? And you think that's acceptable?
      - seanp2k2 10y ago
        You have to pay to have the option to not be spied on, because only the version designed to be used for serious business supports disabling the first-party tracking, because business users are important and home users are just another revenue channel. I now have even less moral issue with not paying to use Windows for personal use. Seriously, they should have just made it free for home users regardless of Win7 license state (I've had terrible luck with "upgraded" versions of Windows -- clean installs only for me, and yes I know about the Insider program and the exception to this...I didn't stay up on the news and I missed the "must be installed by" deadline).
        FussyZeus 10y ago
        If it makes you feel better, my mother was on an insider build because we figured she would get Windows either free or at a discount, and she ended up having to buy retail anyway.
      - 794CD01 10y ago
        You have to pay for Windows just like any other software the creators don't want to give away for free.
        FussyZeus 10y ago
        This point fails thrice: - I am paying for Windows already, that we've established does spy on me - The Enterprise edition is not available to be purchased by a regular consumer anywhere I can locate - The Enterprise edition doesn't allow the disabling of ALL reporting to Redmond, only most, and only via group policy which is hardly accessible to the layman.
- curt15 10y ago
  Where does Microsoft explain what they are sending to domains like ad.doubleclick.net?
  - 794CD01 10y ago
    Exactly where you would expect to find it: the data use and access section of the technet article on the feature, and in the Windows privacy statement.

GrumpyYoungMan 10y ago

I take it that you don't use a smartphone, either, since you have no way of knowing what is transmitted either, either by the primary OS or the secondary radio OS. http://www.osnews.com/story/27416/The_second_operating_system_hiding_in_every_mobile_phone http://www.osnews.com/story/27416/The_second_operating_syste... Or macOS (nee OS X), since Apple gathers telemetry as well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11907060 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11907060 Moreover, security researchers looking to make a name for themselves are crawling all over Windows. If they haven't found anything in the telemetry that makes headlines yet, most likely there's nothing to find. Paranoid or not, telemetry is already everywhere without you knowing what's being sent and it's here to stay. Singling out Windows is ridiculous.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
vetinari 10y ago
> I take it that you don't use a smartphone, either, since you have no way of knowing what is transmitted either, either by the primary OS or the secondary radio OS. You know, two wrongs do not make one right. > Or macOS (nee OS X), since Apple gathers telemetry as well. In OSX, sending telemetry and crash reports is voluntary. It is being asked in the OOB wizard and is easily available in the Settings application. In consumer SKUs of Windows 10, that's not the case, sending telemetry is mandatory. > Paranoid or not, telemetry is already everywhere without you knowing what's being sent and it's here to stay. Too early to say. It may also break Microsoft's neck. > Singling out Windows is ridiculous. Biggest target. They have a great opportunity to lead by example - in the positive way.
whyoh 10y ago
>If they haven't found anything in the telemetry that makes headlines yet, most likely there's nothing to find. There's plenty to be found and Microsoft isn't even hiding it: https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/manage/configure-windows-telemetry-in-your-organization https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/itpro/windows/manage/con... That data, even at the "Basic" level, is enough to be used for 'bad things'. And since it's on someone else's computer you can't know who has access to it, so you can assume the worst. >Singling out Windows is ridiculous. Just Windows 10. Because it's the only mainstream desktop OS with forced telemetry and no opt-out option.