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Edit: Oops, I misread the parent, and I agree that yes, seeking legal help in a case like this is much harder than with robbery, which is hard enough. ----- R

Edit: Oops, I misread the parent, and I agree that yes, seeking legal help in a case like this is much harder than with robbery, which is hard enough. ----- Robbery doesn't really make for a good comparison here: - Did you fear for your own physical safety (e.g. that the thief or their friends/etc might retaliate) in reporting the crime to the police? - Did you known the thief? Did you have friends in common, or did you work together? Will you possibly see social retaliation from the thief's allies for reporting their behavior? - Does everyone involved, including the thief and the police, agree on what defines acceptable/legal behavior, or are you going to be argue with the police and others that just because you wore a sexy dress didn't mean that you "wanted" someone to steal your phone?

incongruity 10y ago
It actually does make a good case, IMHO. The robbery experience is comparably simple for the victim and yet even for that, filing a report and being believed was difficult. Therefore, it makes it completely believable that filing a complaint for something like sexual assault would be undeniably hard for many people, in many cases.
DanBC 10y ago
That's the point -- someone had a difficult experience reporting a robbery, even though the definitions are much clearer and the evidence was much clearer. That person can imagine how much harder it is to report sexual violence.
kej 10y ago
I think that's his point. Dealing with the robbery was bad enough, how much worse must it be when dealing with sexual harassment and assault?
danso 10y ago
Yes, I agree, robbery doesn't make a good comparison with rape because I had every reason to make the accusation of robbery, and such allegations are made on standards of evidence that most people agree on. Even though I knew it was going to be a pain in the ass, it was something that I had to do because 1) hard to file a insurance claim without a police report 2) kind of hard to just let a gun-wielding robber run around. I've had stuff stolen from me and I didn't report it, but armed-robbery is a whole different thing. I did feel paranoid for a few days afterward...after all, he had complete access to my phone and may have gleaned personal information from it before I was able to remotely lock/wipe it. That said, it was still comically annoying to convince the detective. I was asked if I had been drinking (yes). I was asked why did I walk home before going to the police station (because without a phone, I had to get on the Internet to look up the nearest police station). I was asked why I didn't call 911 on a pay phone (...because, it literally did not occur to me that pay phones still work...?). I was asked why I walked from Chelsea through a "lively" section of town (Bleecker Street in Greenwich Village), a place known for prostitution, when I could've taken a more direct route (because it's a nice night, and I literally get lost everytime I wander off the grid in the West Village). To say that the detective didn't believe me is an understatement. He actually accused me of soliciting a prostitute, and that my "lost" items were a result of me getting in over my head with a savvy prostitute. But I didn't feel terribly offended because I knew I had evidence that could place me at the time of the incident, and other hard facts, such as how the robber ended up using my Netflix account to watch "Prison Break" in the days following the robbery. A rape victim has none of that assurance. Even if the rape kit comes through, unless the rape is stranger rape, the rape kit does not contain hard facts about consent or intent. All those questions that were asked of me are going to be asked of the victim...except with far more difficult insinuations. After I told my roommate of my interrogation by the cops, she proceeded to tell me of her friends' similar stories...such as how a (female) cop was insistent on asking the victim why she would ever invite her friend (the accused) up to her apartment for tea. And then there's the difficulty of answering those questions after having recently suffering the physical and emotional trauma of being raped. I have no idea what that feels like; my attacker was a jerk but otherwise left me unharmed.
- dantillberg 10y ago
  Thanks to another poster, I realized I'd misread your last paragraph as "yeah, it's hard to go to the police, but I did it, too." Sorry! I totally agree with everything you're saying here.

incongruity 10y ago

It actually does make a good case, IMHO. The robbery experience is comparably simple for the victim and yet even for that, filing a report and being believed was difficult. Therefore, it makes it completely believable that filing a complaint for something like sexual assault would be undeniably hard for many people, in many cases.

DanBC 10y ago

That's the point -- someone had a difficult experience reporting a robbery, even though the definitions are much clearer and the evidence was much clearer. That person can imagine how much harder it is to report sexual violence.

kej 10y ago

I think that's his point. Dealing with the robbery was bad enough, how much worse must it be when dealing with sexual harassment and assault?

danso 10y ago

Yes, I agree, robbery doesn't make a good comparison with rape because I had every reason to make the accusation of robbery, and such allegations are made on standards of evidence that most people agree on. Even though I knew it was going to be a pain in the ass, it was something that I had to do because 1) hard to file a insurance claim without a police report 2) kind of hard to just let a gun-wielding robber run around. I've had stuff stolen from me and I didn't report it, but armed-robbery is a whole different thing. I did feel paranoid for a few days afterward...after all, he had complete access to my phone and may have gleaned personal information from it before I was able to remotely lock/wipe it. That said, it was still comically annoying to convince the detective. I was asked if I had been drinking (yes). I was asked why did I walk home before going to the police station (because without a phone, I had to get on the Internet to look up the nearest police station). I was asked why I didn't call 911 on a pay phone (...because, it literally did not occur to me that pay phones still work...?). I was asked why I walked from Chelsea through a "lively" section of town (Bleecker Street in Greenwich Village), a place known for prostitution, when I could've taken a more direct route (because it's a nice night, and I literally get lost everytime I wander off the grid in the West Village). To say that the detective didn't believe me is an understatement. He actually accused me of soliciting a prostitute, and that my "lost" items were a result of me getting in over my head with a savvy prostitute. But I didn't feel terribly offended because I knew I had evidence that could place me at the time of the incident, and other hard facts, such as how the robber ended up using my Netflix account to watch "Prison Break" in the days following the robbery. A rape victim has none of that assurance. Even if the rape kit comes through, unless the rape is stranger rape, the rape kit does not contain hard facts about consent or intent. All those questions that were asked of me are going to be asked of the victim...except with far more difficult insinuations. After I told my roommate of my interrogation by the cops, she proceeded to tell me of her friends' similar stories...such as how a (female) cop was insistent on asking the victim why she would ever invite her friend (the accused) up to her apartment for tea. And then there's the difficulty of answering those questions after having recently suffering the physical and emotional trauma of being raped. I have no idea what that feels like; my attacker was a jerk but otherwise left me unharmed.

dantillberg 10y ago
Thanks to another poster, I realized I'd misread your last paragraph as "yeah, it's hard to go to the police, but I did it, too." Sorry! I totally agree with everything you're saying here.